The Watering Hole: Wednesday, April 6, 2011: Hump Day

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There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. Genesis 6:4

And in this one passage in Genesis, all of the ancient myths are incorporated into the Bible.

Who were these “sons of God” who impregnated the daughters of men? Do their genes still flow in our gene pool?

This is our daily open thread. What do you think of this and other stuff that’s going on?

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253 thoughts on “The Watering Hole: Wednesday, April 6, 2011: Hump Day”

  1. Good Morning , BnF … Happy Hump Day All!

    I am happy to share all my thoughts on God, and blue cars, after my first cup off coffee. My loclocal coffee shop opens at 7am, which is actually late for me. If only I had good organic freah roasted coffee within walking distance … And if that coffee is nearby at this hour, I’d happily eat last nights veggie leftovers with it ;)
    ‘ll
    For now, I will get ready to walk back to my local 7am lavazza rush … I actually love hanging out there’s on my day off. I’ll wait there until I receive some divine intervention … Love, Angel … :)

  2. As you say BnF, Genesis 6:4 is a catchy verse that lumps all the old gods and monsters together, with a cleverly worded allusion to “special men”, whether they were alien/hominid hybrids or just Og, Glog and Mog getting lucky one day while out picking mushrooms.

  3. Morning all. Not good news from Wi. Looking over the vote results blue collar Wi is buying Wankerism. They are listening to the propaganda. This does not bode well for America in the next election. The Supreme Court election will likely go into automatic recount and will quite probably turn as ugly as the Coleman mess in Mn.

    There is one possible saving grace. If the R’s continue on their present course we will likely see an even bigger recession/Depression before the 12 elections. If they shut down the government, we will see it before the end of summer.

  4. Lessee, I forget. How to spell ‘bullshit’? Hmmm. G*E*N*E*S*I*S ??

    Personally, in re creation myths I much prefer those of Polynesia. Far more interesting than the Abrahamic nonsense. Here’s one that explains everything anyone needs to know about why life prospers and why sunrises and sunsets look as they do (as repeated in The Incessant Voice of War):

    In ancient times, there lived The Great Octopus, Tumu-rai-fenua, who held the sky close to the earth with his tentacles, and all was in darkness. At the same time, when Tangaroa, the god of the sea, broke free from Rumia, the shell, and saw the dark and empty space, he wanted to create life. And he did. But Tumu-rai-fenua refused to let go his grip on earth and sky, and so everything remained in darkness. Eventually, the well-intentioned Rua-tupua-nui, a creation of Tangaroa, managed to kill the octopus. But still its tentacles held fast to the earth and sky, and all the people were afraid. But then one day came Maui-ti’i-ti’i and he cut off the arms of the dead octopus, releasing its grip. Then, from the highest mountain, he spoke to Tangaroa’s brother, Tane, the god of the sky. Tane agreed to free the sky from the earth, to let in the light, and then he laid reeds bearing red blossoms on the sea to forever hold up the sky. We still see them every day, both at sunrise and at sunset.

  6. Morning all!
    So I get to work, get started up, take a breakfast break, log into TP only to see.

    The site has blocked you from posting new comments

    WTF?
    So now I’m a troll?

    P.S. I’m quite certain the BuyBull was referring to the race of aliens who inhabited the planet lo those many eons ago…

    FU TP.

  7. Joseph E. Stiglitz addresses increasing income inequality:

    “The top 1 percent have the best houses, the best educations, the best doctors, and the best lifestyles, but there is one thing that money doesn’t seem to have bought: an understanding that their fate is bound up with how the other 99 percent live. Throughout history, this is something that the top 1 percent eventually do learn. Too late.”

    And that is why conservatives should be as worried as liberals about the decline of a thriving middle class, a unifying force in every society.

    http://www.vanityfair.com/society/features/2011/05/top-one-percent-201105?currentPage=all&wpisrc=nl_wonk

  8. I’m quite certain the BuyBull was referring to the race of aliens who inhabited the planet lo those many eons ago…

    Much of Planet Earth’s human population clearly is a result of the interbreeding of evolved but still primitive domestic apes with those who arrived as tenants on this cosmically designated Intergalactic Penal Colony for the Criminally Insane. For the typical end result, see George W. Bush and/or Rand Paul, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, Sharron Angle, and teabaggers in general.

    Residents of the Zoo clearly came from elsewhere. Which explains why no one here seems to have any interest in interbreeding with “them” other than via the oft spoken epithet, FU.

    I shall study the bi-bull for evidence of the above theses, and report back when I find it. Actually, if I can find a genuine bi-bull, I’ll know I’m on the right track as it would explain a lot.

    I need more coffee.

  9. I think I figured out why I’m banned from TP. I left a post on the Koch protest thread that we know where they live, work, and they’d better hire some mercs for security.
    Apparently they construed it as a threat, and presto, I’m banned.

    Oh well, the trolls seem to have no problem making threats, etc. So they can have the site.

  10. Well, having giants and angels porking Adam and Eve’s kids is a lot more comforting than the inbreeding that would otherwise have had to be. Just think, we could all be descended from the ancient equivalent of trailer trash. Too bad that two people isn’t even a gene drop, let alone a pool.

    Mythology can be fun.

  13. Probably the real reason they were kicked out of the Garden of Eden.
    Adam wanted to turn it into a mobile home park with plans for a Wal-mart and a McDonalds near the entrance gates.

  14. zxbe, I’m afraid the closeness of the race is going to trigger an automatic recount which, in itself, could prove to be real interesting.

  17. Here’s my take on it, something I wrote back in the late seventies. It looks longer than it is, but still, a study of how to be impolite in a nice way via poetry, well, we can’t all be CheeseFlaps!

    A godman and a skeptic met
    To promulgate their views,
    With godman’s premise, Genesis,
    And skeptic’s, more the muse.

    “God made the heavens and the Earth,”
    The passioned godman says,
    “And, furthermore, He did all this,
    In only seven days.”

    “But whence came God?” the skeptic asked,
    With some temerity,
    The godman said, “Don’t question that,
    For such is blasphemy! ”

    The skeptic glowered for a time,
    Then asked, “How old’ s the Earth?”
    “Six thousand years,” the godman said,
    “Including day of birth.

    “With firmaments united, then,
    The Earth was paradise,
    The beasts, the fields, and finally man,
    Enjoyed all without vice.

    “And God made Adam first, then Eve,
    Who were, as you shall see,
    Progenitors of all mankind,
    Kin of humanity.

    “For from their loins came many sons,
    Who married, then produced,
    Our father’s father’s ancestors,
    As, biblically, deduced.

    “Thus, all the Earth is born of God,
    And man’s the child of Eve,
    So, lie thee down in prostrate form
    And hail the Lord! Believe!”

    Then godman smiled, smug, and secure
    His theses were correct,
    For Genesis came straight from God,
    In veritas, direct.

    “Oh, I believe,” the skeptic said,
    “Though not the way you think,
    From what I’ve heard, the Universe
    Arrived in just a wink.

    “A coalescing, then a flash,
    And galaxies were cleaved
    From ether, dust, and energy,
    If science is believed.

    “Five billion years, or ten, or twelve
    Had passed, when life arrived,
    And finally men, though not like us,
    From lower forms derived.

    “And, furthermore, a question, sir,
    About the sons of Eve,
    Whence came the daughters, for her sons,
    Mankind, therefrom, conceived?”

    The godman cringed and raised his hand
    Toward heaven, in disgust,
    “If those are your beliefs, my friend,
    You’ll burn in hell, please trust.

    “For God, I know, has no rapport
    With those who pray to see
    The wisdom He withholds from men
    For all eternity.”

    “Your last remark makes little sense,”
    Said skeptic, feigning dread,
    “If you are asking we believe
    God deems our brains be dead.

    “For, if somewhere in endless space
    A Creator exists
    Who gave us minds to seek out truth,
    Then why should we resist?”

    The godman’s face showed beads of sweat,
    He offered no reply,
    He simply stared toward heaven’ s void
    As wispy clouds rolled by.

    “May heathen burn,” the godman prayed,
    “They’re evil, stubborn men,
    And Lord, as why you sent them here?
    Well, that’s beyond my ken.

    “Perhaps to try me, for a time,
    Before I’m laid to rest?
    Convert some souls to heaven’s song?
    Yes, likely that’s my test.

    “But sure it is now’s not the time
    To use the Holy See
    As evidence, Your true intent,
    Thy Word’s inerrancy.”

    Then godman turned toward skeptic, sad,
    This man, his nemesis,
    Would not accept such grand design,
    God’ s apotheosis.

    “We’ll meet again, my wayward friend,
    By then, perhaps, you’ll learn,
    That only through the Word of God,
    In hell’s fire, you won’t burn.”

    “I doubt it, sir,” the skeptic said,
    “For you’ve confirmed my choice,
    That words beyond the biblical
    Can speak with reasoned voice.

    “And, too, you see, I have no need
    To live in metaphor,
    I’d rather seek, expand my mind,
    Maintain an open door.

    “To blindly mimic premises
    Is not what God has deemed;
    It seems more likely He mandates
    That light, from dark, be gleaned,

    “And so, my friend, while I suggest
    That your beliefs you keep,
    Recall God sees us all as lambs,
    Though not, I think, as sheep.”

    Then skeptic turned and walked away,
    Face bent as if to smile,
    Safe Genesis was put to bed,
    If but for just awhile.

    Amen.

  18. At what point is an automatic recount triggered, Hooda? How close does it have to be?

    Presumably, with it this close, I suppose either candidate would and should ask for a recount on their own.

  19. Yeah, hooda, I would expect that this becomes automatic recount fodder. Fair enough. But you have to know that process is going to get ugly. The Koch brothers aren’t going to spare any expense in trying to thwart the process.

  20. Today is National Tartan Day!

    Frugal, your poem is wonderful and I thank you for sharing it.

  21. If the R’s shut down the government, my family may be in a depression by the end of next week.

  22. Any way of knowing which precincts are remaining? I can see which counties they are in, and assuming the trend for those counties hold, the remaining votes outstanding votes are virtually a tie. (Also assuming, an equal distribution of voters per precinct.)

  23. Off to the movies with my son, hut I love the thread exploring different Creation stories……here is one from a feminist point of view….hope you enjoy!!!!

    Once, long ago when the skies crackled the lightening and the seas rolled with waves as tall as mountains, the world we know was born.

    The night sky twinkled with 10,000,000 stars, and the day sky was alive with the brilliance of a close star, the Sun. Sunbeams reflected in clouds that shone like polished mirrors. The Earth was covered with a beautiful blanket of swirling water, lovely but fierce.

    In all this beauty, nothing moved, save the sky and sea. There were no fishes, no whales, and no dolphins in the waters. There was no land, and so, no humans, or tiger, or lizards or bugs. And in the sky, no butterflies, no bees, and no birds save one.

    The only creature who existed was Isis, the Great Mother. She who would birth and mother the world we know. Her great body was longer than a football field and her mighty wings spread wide as a city. She was born of lightning and seafoam on brilliant day long, long ago. It was when the lightning struck the sea and raised foam high into the air. The foam vibrated with the energy of the Universe and as it dropped back toward the sea, it took form and became the Great Mother.

    For a million years the great Mother flew over the oceans and looked for others like herself, but there were none. She was lonely beyond all imagining, her only comfort were the star, the lightening, the sea, and the wind that whispered the word Isis. Since wind was her closest companion She came to think of Isis as Her name, since it was the sound the wind spoke to Her.

    “What am I to do friend wind? Friend stars? Friend sea? Friend lightening?”
    She asked.

    The wind did not answer, the stars did not answer, and the sea did not answer. Only lightening answered with a crack and a boom.

    One single bolt of lightening struck deep into the sea; it dove deep, blazing with light. Past the waves, past the depths, past the swirls and currents, past all that Isis knew and into the heart of the Earth.

    As stars, wind and sea watched, lightening brought forth a gush of bright red liquid. There had never been red before and all were amazed. Up it came, past the swirls and currents, past the depths, past the waves, and into the sky in a blazing red pillar of fire liquid. Up, up, up it soared, and down, down, down it fell, turning black and gray as it fell. And where it fell, there grew great solid mounds.

    On and on it spewed, for years and years and years. It spewed bright hot red fire liquid until plains, and valleys and mountains had joined the mounds. The sea at last had a friend to touch and caress, the stars had a solid form to look upon, and lightening had a solid place to strike, but Isis still was lonely, for She was the only creature who breathed.

    Her sadness grew steadily, until one day when the tears came. Flying over the sea and the great mounds, Her sadness was too much to bear any longer, and Isis began to cry. Her tears fell upon the water and the mounds, and the plains and the valleys and the mountains. The tears that landed on the sea disappeared beneath the waves. Those that landed on solid ground slid across the hard dark surface and flowed into the Earth. Then something amazing happened, with each tear She shed, a small green plot appeared. Slowly at first, barely visible and tiny, the green came bursting from the Earth and into the sunlight.

    Isis cried for 10,000 years and stopped only when She accepted the fact that She might always be alone, with her friends the stars, wind, sea and lightening.

    Sea was the first to notice that something was happening. Deep beneath her waves, Ocean felt the stirrings of small creatures. At first, she thought they were just little currents and swirls, but soon she knew the truth. She said nothing, this was her own delicious secret, and she had never had a secret before. When the life inside her became strong and abundant she spoke.

    “Friend Isis, I am sorry you are sad, but I thank you for your tears.” Ocean said in deep rumbling waves.

    “Thank me?” Isis asked perplexed. “Why do you thank me, friend Ocean?”

    “I thank you because every tear you shed upon me became a new living creature. I am full of living, breathing things!” The Sea said proudly, swooshing each word.

    “Living…? Breathing…? Like me?” Isis gasped, She was beside herself with excitement.

    “Your tears held life, come and look upon it.” Ocean said.

    Sure enough, there just beneath the waves Isis saw them, shining and brilliant, swimming and floating and moving happily beneath the waves.
    There were anemones and fishes of all colors, creatures with eight legs, starfish and tiny plankton by the millions, whales and crabs and dolphins and corals all embraced by Oceans briny essence.

    Isis spread Her massive wings and flew happily above the waves looking at each creature with amazement and delight. She began to laugh, giggle, and call out in joy.

    “Come and see dear friends, we are no longer alone. Friend stars, friend lightening, friend wind, come and see” She shrieked. “Come and see all the living things in friend Ocean”

    Wind blew by and was astonished to see a whale leap into his path, from beneath Ocean’s waves. The stars saw their light reflected by a million, million tiny scales acting like mirrors, glistening just under Ocean’s swirling surface.” Lightening danced in the sky to celebrate the wondrous day.

    Isis flew to the tallest mound to reflect on the miracle of life. All this new life had sparked something in Her, and She was happy.

    When daylight came, there were even more surprises. The sun shone upon the mounds, the plains, the valleys, and the mountains, but they were no longer lifeless humps and dips.

    Green growing things covered most of the land. Where it had been only barren rock and dirt, now green things grew. All over the land in small clumps, plants and trees and flowers appeared. There were even small mossy tufts growing where Isis had slept on the mountain.

    Isis spread Her massive wings and flew over the land, dropping a feather here and there. She could not believe the beauty of the green, and in Her frenzy of joy Isis shook a thousand feathers from Her wings.

    As each feather floated gently to Earth, animals were born. Wherever a feather landed, it was transformed into an animal. Feathers gently fell upon the ground, and within a twinkling, each feather stretched, transformed and became a unique living creature. There were lizards, and cats and elephants and Opossums. There were mice, wolves, beavers, antelope and hyenas. Also upon the ground were snails and snakes and spiders and ants. Butterflies took wing and filled the air above the flowers along with bees and dragonflies.

    Life was exploding into being everywhere Isis looked, and at last, She was truly a part of a living world.

    Each day that passed brought new and unexpected gifts from the Earth and Sea. Isis still spent most of Her time with Her ancient friends, wind, stars, lightning and Ocean, for the realm that was Her true home was high above the Earth. She was a creature of the air. Isis longed for companions to fly free with, but alas, for all the creatures of Earth and Sea, there were none that shared Her gift of flight. There were none but those who swam or crawled or slithered. They were Her family, and she loved them, but She still longed to soar and reel and dive with companions.

    Isis wanted to show the others how magic and beautiful the wind felt beneath a wing, and how lovely the stars were up close. Only the insects shared Her gift for flying, but they could not fly high and soar as She could.

    One night atop the great mountain, Isis did something very strange. She began to gather twigs and sticks and dried leaves from the valley below, and carry them to the top of the mountain. The animals watched and wondered what on Earth She was doing. Isis would have told them, if She had known herself, but She did not.

    Slowly and patiently She picked up each twig in Her beak and wove it into a sort of circle, when it was finished, She placed leaves and moss in the bottom and settled down to sleep upon Her new creation.

    The night passed quickly and still she slept, Isis slept for one hundred days and one hundred nights before awakening. All of Her friends wondered what was happening, but She was smiling in Her sleep, and so they waited patiently for Her to awake.

    Isis awoke with a smile and a secret of Her own, life had been growing inside Her, just as it grew in Ocean. She sat on Her nest for the next few days and then called to Her friend’s to come and visit Her. There was great excitement among the creatures. Only, wind, lightening, stars and ocean knew what was about to happen.

    When the creatures reached the top of the mountain, there Isis sat atop her nest and thirteen shimmering eggs. There were eggs of all colors, each more beautiful than the next.

    When all the creatures had gathered, Isis smiled, spread Her massive wings and stood up. She stepped away from the nest and gazed at it proudly. Soon the slightest pecking sounds could be heard and one by one, tiny holes appeared in the eggs. The first egg to open revealed owl, raven and albatross, tumbling into the nest. The other eggs open quickly and out spilled downy chicks of all kinds, there were; pheasants, hummingbirds, hawks, robins, chickadees, swans, finch, chickens, egrets, wrens, bluebirds, eagles, condors, gulls, parrots, jays, penguins, toucans, and tiny ostrich.

    Soon the nest was a symphony of song and warbling of all manner. Isis looked at Her brood and Her friends and smiled, they were all so different, so beautiful, and so wonderful. They were all miracles of life. The chicks grew and filled the skies, and life on the Earth and in the Sea renewed itself

    Isis spread Her wings wide and soared into the heaven to thank wind, stars, and lightning, then swooped low to thank Ocean.

    There was just one thing still missing, one thing the Great Mother still had to do. She flew to the top of the mountain and gathered the eggs shell pieces in Her nest, then She asked the other creatures to put a bit of their fur, or a scale, or something of themselves into the nest. None of the creatures understood, but they were happy to help their friend. Isis gripped the nest with Her mighty arms and flew back to friend Ocean.

    “Ocean, may I gather some of your water in my nest?” She asked.

    “My creatures will not miss a nestfull, yes you may dear friend.” Ocean said happily. Isis filled the nest with Ocean’s water and flew high into the sky. She flew and flew, until She found just the right spot in the sky. Then She fluttered Her feathery wings over the nest and spun in circles high above the clouds. Isis spun and spun until even the stars were dizzy. When She stopped spinning the nest, the fur, the scales, the eggshells, and leaves all were gone, and there in the sky, in their place, was a round, glowing sphere.

    She called Her creation the Moon. It was a glowing; glimmering nightlight that the Great Mother created for all Earth’s creatures. Seeing the beauty of the Moon, She set it spinning around with the power of Her great wings, and set it to reflect the light of the nearest star friend, the Sun. She set the
    Moon to move in phases, so that all would remember the time before Moon, and the every changing cycles of life and creation.

    And so it began…..the journey of life on the planet we know as Earth.

  24. zxbe, the two remaining in Milwaukee County will be key. Juneau and Taylor have low populations. Jefferson could be a stinker.

  26. If the R’s shut down the government, my family may be in a depression by the end of next week.

    I’m ok till the fourth Wednesday in April. If my S.S. check doesn’t arrive that morning, times will get tough REAL fast! I know that since I’m an old, poor, lazy, not employed, registered Democrat bum whose sole virtue is blond hair, blue eyes, and a bulging midriff I’m as expendable and worthless as was any Jew in Germany, but I mean c’mon, what happened to the America I learned about in school 60 yrs ago, the country I supported financially for the better part of 40 years, now reduced to little more than an orangey tan Boner!?

  28. So, about blue cars … 3gen Prius lt blue metallic … one can only hope … :)

    frugal, your poem moved me … especially the part about he lambs … )

    krissy, I love the Isis stories! And loved watching that cheezey 70′s Saturday am show where the lady would spin in a circle and say “O Mighty Isis!” … Shazzam!!!

    i was just talking with a local Polynesian woman before I arrive home … I would love to share that creation story with her … :)

    And last, but certainly not least, I am already to go to NYC for the Muir screening, sans a pair of hose I can pick up on the way.

  29. In the beginning, there was a big bang.
    And no one heard the bang, or saw anything.
    And it was good.

  30. I am packed for a few days in case I decide to staybin the Big Apple; dog will need to come with me as finding a last minute sitter is not as easy as it appears around these parts … she does love a good car ride … )

  34. Outstanding — I’ve been in a depression since 1994 when the Republicans first took over Congress. ;-)

  36. My son went to a Waldorf school when he was young and I always enjoyed the creation myths that they learned in class. My son’s favorite was the Norse Gods. The stories of Odin and Baldaur always delighted him. I will see if I can find some excerpts.

    I have errands to run. I’ll check back later.

  37. In olden times there were giants and dragons and unicorns and who knows what else. Now, 6,000 years later, they are all gone. Mankind is obviously not environmentally friendly. Nor does he play well with others.

  38. A 15 yo niece asks, seriously, if Jesus could only walk on water – how would/did he bathe or swim ‘in those days’. She’s the surfer, lifeguard, water polo player and can’t imagine not being able to be in the water.
    A friend of hers is religious (niece is raised in an atheist household, yet encouraged to explore religion – she’s gone with a friend to a fudie church – has totally dismissed that. Dismissed catholicism after attending with another friend.)
    It’s that friend who was talking about Jesus walking on water that got (niece) to thinking on that aspect.

    ~ Did Jesus have the choice to walk on water go wading/ swimming? or Was he ‘cursed’ to always have to walk on any body of water he came across?

  39. My 8 year old daughter is enthralled with all of Mythology. It makes for great strecthes of the imagination…! See Bible, James, King Version.

  41. So Jefferson is now the key. Kloppenburg leads by 224 votes. Prosser would have to pull a pretty high percentage (something like 70%) of the votes in that last precinct to overcome that.

  42. Ebb, I side with your 15 Y.O. niece. Made me wonder. Jesus was baptized, no? In the river by San Juan Bautista, no? How’d that happen? Be like trying to baptize a helium balloon, no?

  45. There are certain services that are not effected by a Federal Gov’t “shutdown.” These include things like the military, and Social Security. So those checks will continue to go out.

  46. He lost some efficiency paddling with his hands as well, when he was forced to swim.

  47. Glenn Beck Leaving FOX Show by the End of the Year

    Glenn Beck is pulling the plug on his popular daily show for Fox News.

    In a release his production company says he will “transition” away from his Fox News show later this year.

    According to the release Beck won’t jump ship entirely. He’ll develop a variety of programs for Fox News and its digital properties.

    So now he will do the hit and run style guesting like the other Faux Fascists.

    I like y’alls tartans.

  48. Zooey, that would be our trend setter – House of Roberts who had the brilliance to be the first to show his colors!

  49. There are certain services that are not effected by a Federal Gov’t “shutdown.” These include things like the military, and Social Security. So those checks will continue to go out.

    I always believed as much, too, Gary, but TP is reporting that soldiers will not get paid while they continue to fight the wars.

    http://thinkprogress.org/2011/04/06/troops-pay-shutdown/

    If accurate, it’s completely immoral, but that’s government by Republicans for you.

  50. You folks who are sporting Tartan avatar’s better be wearing undergarments!!

  52. Almost as soon as I posted the previous, I began finding articles that claimed otherwise. The stuff I read that I based my last post on was from a while ago (at least a month) so I’ve no way of tracking back to it.

  53. Well, those drawers would look at home on a golf course, if Lucy and Ethel were playing.

    • Gary, the Regimental tartan is very nice, but I thought I’d go with the tartan that matches an old family name — although, as far as I know that’s not the branch of the family from Ireland and Scotland (which I’ve only known about for ~a year).

  62. There we go. Now it’s working. Like Z, I just went with what I have been told is the old family name.

  63. My favorite creation myth; Lakota
    There was another world before this one. But the people of that world did not behave themselves. Displeased, the Creating Power set out to make a new world. He sang several songs to bring rain, which poured stronger with each song. As he sang the fourth song, the earth split apart and water gushed up through the many cracks, causing a flood. By the time the rain stopped, all of the people and nearly all of the animals had drowned. Only Kangi the crow survived.

    Kangi pleaded with the Creating Power to make him a new place to rest. So the Creating Power decided the time had come to make his new world. From his huge pipe bag, which contained all types of animals and birds, the Creating Power selected four animals known for their ability to remain under water for a long time.

    He sent each in turn to retrieve a lump of mud from beneath the floodwaters. First the loon dove deep into the dark waters, but it was unable to reach the bottom. The otter, even with its strong webbed feet, also failed. Next, the beaver used its large flat tail to propel itself deep under the water, but it too brought nothing back. Finally, the Creating Power took the turtle from his pipe bag and urged it to bring back some mud.

    Turtle stayed under the water for so long that everyone was sure it had drowned. Then, with a splash, the turtle broke the water’s surface! Mud filled its feet and claws and the cracks between its upper and lower shells. Singing, the Creating Power shaped the mud in his hands and spread it on the water, where it was just big enough for himself and the crow. He then shook two long eagle wing feathers over the mud until earth spread wide and varied, overcoming the waters. Feeling sadness for the dry land, the Creating Power cried tears that became oceans, streams, and lakes. He named the new land Turtle Continent in honor of the turtle who provided the mud from which it was formed.

    The Creating Power then took many animals and birds from his great pipe bag and spread them across the Earth. From red, white, black, and yellow earth, he made men and women. The Creating Power gave the people his sacred pipe and told them to live by it. He warned them about the fate of the people who came before them. He promised all would be well if all living things learned to live in harmony. But the world would be destroyed again if they made it bad and ugly.

    - Lakota Star Knowledge

  67. Go to the top of the comments – to the left where the ‘like’ button is:

    It looks like a clothesline – down to the shorts waving in the breeze! ;>

  69. The AP is double checking with the counties for all the numbers they’ve reported so far. Kloppenburg’s lead has risen to 336; a rise of 99 votes. (This is very likely due to a transposition error somewhere.)

  73. zcbe, I must be doing something wrong, I uploaded a genuine authentic MacBeth tartan, and I get the skinny legged brainy amoeba avatar I’ve never seen in my life before…? Thanks, WordPretzel?!
    Not my day today, banned on TP and switched out on my avatar here.
    Methinks I should be very careful driving home today!

    • Gary, I just used the Google on “Regimental tartan” and became a bit distracted. Don’t hold me to a high standard here… ;)

  77. RUC – MacBeth has shown colors! Nice blue and red combination in that plaid you chose!

  78. The numbers keep changing on the AP site, but Kloppenburg still has a 336 vote lead.

  79. Thanks Ebb, now I just need to make sure I don’t get any stains on it from the vigorous cauldron stirring this evening around midnight.

  85. Gary, that’s just great. If it does happen, I’ll be taking food down to Fort Lewis and distributing it from the back of my car. Asshowl Republicans…

  86. Raven, but we shouldn’t touch the jet engine made in GA that the pentagone doesn’t even want…

  87. RUC…I was thinking more along the lines of ‘Benson’ and ‘Robert’ from Time Bandits…

  88. Hey, Republicans, great strategy to get the military to support you. Is there any other group of Americans you care to dump on to get their support?

  90. If Amurka can’t even afford to pay her soldiers, can she really afford to pay old farts like me?

    Frankly, I’m about to say to the conservative wackos, go ahead, kill the government, you stupid shits. Destroy the country. It’s been your goddam goal for as long as you’ve been around.

    A suggestion, though: learn to speak Chinese before you pull the plug. It’ll come in handy for you, probably sooner than later.

  92. The troops in combat won’t notice personally (nothing to buy in Afghanistan), but their families will hit very, very hard.

    But will the Repugnantcons get blamed for it? I won’t hold my breath.

  95. I can’t help but think that worry over whether or not their families at home can pay their bills will be an unnecessary and dangerous distraction for our men and women serving overseas.

  98. KloJo’s margin is pretty close to Al Franken’s in 2008, no? Could be she’s off to a good start in Recountville.

    What I can’t figure is how the hell it could ever be so close, given the events in WI the last couple of months: the protests, the recalls, the passions — what happened? I was thinking that Wisconsin might set a trend and relegate the Republicans (aka the S.S. — Stupid Shits) to a permanent minority of, say, 20%. Instead, a recount? Hard to imagine.

  99. Hi gang.

    The stupid trolls seem to be in firm control of TP today so I’ve been devoting my time to the goose issue. For those who missed it, a pair of Canada geese have built a nest about ten feet from the back door of my building. Five eggs are confirmed. Daddy goose is pretty fierce and has been chasing kids, adults, and even cars that get too close. Tonight is the monthly tenant meeting and we’re going to discuss whether to adapt to the geese or ask the DNR to remove them. If we are forced to sacrifice a nest it would not put a dent i the local goose population.

    Personally, I think the whole situation is pretty cool and am enjoying the opportunity to capture some great closeups. On the other hand, I would feel terrible if a child were hurt running from a goose and would feel almost as bad if Daddy Goose lost a stare-down with a car. Unfortunately, due to fire regulations, we can’t adopt the best option for the geese and close the entrance by their nest.

    The next best option for the geese would be to leave the entrance open and ask people not to use it unless there’s a fire. We’ll have to see how much resistance there is to that option. Since I have much experience with critters I have volunteered to work with maintenance and try to figure out where to put “caution tape” around the nesting area. I’ll keep you posted.

  100. frugal,

    I think the reason it’s so close is that there was a huge advertising blitz by the Reichwhiners that increased their turnout while the events with the protests over the collective bargaining bill brought out Democrats in record numbers for such an “unimportant” election. Of course, those who are most likely to vote for GOoPers generally turn out in bigger numbers to begin with.

  104. Ooop – didn’t see that House had already posted it. Sorry for the redundant info. But it was worth repeating.

  105. pete – please do keep up updated. Any idea how long ago she laid eggs?
    The positive on this: after all hatch – the goslings follow mom to the water.

  106. The Norse version of Creation:

    Originally there was a chasm, Ginnungagap, bounded on either side by fire (from the world known as Muspelheim) and ice (from the world known as Niflheim). When fire and ice met, they combined to form a giant, named Ymir, and a cow, named Audhumbla (Auðhumla), who nourished Ymir. She survived by licking the salty ice blocks. From her licking emerged Bur (Búri), the grandfather of the Aesir. Ymir, father of the frost giants, employed equally unusual procreative techniques. He sweated a male and a female from under his left arm.

    Odin, the son of Bur’s son Borr, killed Ymir. The blood pouring out of the giant’s body killed all the frost giants Ymir had created, except Bergelmir. From Ymir’s dead body, Odin created the world. Ymir’s blood was the sea; his flesh, the earth; his skull, the sky; his bones, the mountains; his hair, the trees. The new Ymir-based world was Midgard. Ymir’s eyebrow was used to fence in the area where mankind would live. Around Midgard was an ocean where a serpent named Jormungand lived. He was big enough to form a ring around Midgard by putting his tail in his mouth.

    From Ymir’s body grew an ash tree named Yggdrasil whose branches covered the known world and supported the universe. Ygdrasil had three roots going to each of the 3 levels of the world. Three springs supplied it with water. One root went into Asgard, the home of the gods, another went into the land of the giants, Jotunheim, and a third went to that primeval world of ice, darkness, and the dead, known as Niflheim. In Jotunheim’s spring, Mimir, lay wisdom. In Niflheim, the spring nourished the adder Nidhogge (darkness) who gnawed at the roots of Ygdrasil.

    The spring by the Asgard root was cared for by the 3 Norns, goddesses of fate:
    Urdur (the past)
    Verdandi (the present), and
    Skuld (the future)

    ——-

    As plausible a creation story as any I’ve heard. Besides, who can resist a man and woman being sweated from the Armpits of a God?

  107. badmoodman, I read the Beck circling the commode article, and was well pleased. Murdoch couldn’t handle the cash flow opportunity cost any more. Now if only a sign from the FSM were to smite his smarmy ass… Got Thor?

  108. KloJo’s margin is pretty close to Al Franken’s in 2008, no? Could be she’s off to a good start in Recountville.

    Obviously each state’s going to have it’s own rules for what triggers a recount, if WI does have such rules, it would seem that this is going to be close enough to trigger it. Then of course what does state law allow for challenges etc.

    What I can’t figure is how the hell it could ever be so close, given the events in WI the last couple of months: the protests, the recalls, the passions — what happened?

    Koch money. It can buy a lot of “get out the vote” stuff. It can also destroy an otherwise good candidate.

  109. Referencing a previous Zoo post from a few days ago…

    “You expect that wolves will eat meat,” – Mike Huckabee on Mother Jones’ correct article detailing the destruction of his records of his time as Arkansas governor.

  110. Zooey bait:

    “The suggestion that victims of sexual assault are partially to blame for wearing revealing clothing is ludicrous, indicative of serious self-loathing and makes me want to vomit all over my computer screen. The writer seems to believe that she’s respecting herself by wearing more conservative clothing. In reality, however, she’s turning over her power to men and accepting this cycle of abuse. The idea that men have always been this way and that women have to adapt is so defeatist and in a way, allows these assaults to actually occur. If you think you’re respecting yourself and receiving a “Get Out of Rape Free” card by wearing demure clothing, you’re delusional.

    Here’s what it comes down to: Any victim of sexual assault is in no way responsible for the attack. “Oh, I apologize that my super cute dress from Zara caused you to force yourself on me. Next time I’ll wear a burka!” As fucking if. How does anyone expect women to advance as a gender if we subscribe to these rules?”

    http://thoughtcatalog.com/2011/were-so-sorry-about-the-funny-thing-about-the-slutwalk/

  112. Ebb,

    She built the nest yesterday morning and there were three eggs yesterday afternoon. Two more eggs this morning. 23-28 days till they hatch. If we decide to let them stay I would NOT want to be the guy who sees how close one can approach with a lawn-mower!

  114. zxbe: Koch money. It can buy a lot of “get out the vote” stuff. It can also destroy an otherwise good candidate.

    I guess what I can’t figure is how or why any amount of advertising should or could EVER impact educated common sense and information-based knowledge enough to cause … umm … someone who is … umm … educated and aware … umm …

    Never mind.

  115. frugal,

    I’m still addicted to film so it will be awhile before I can post pictures but I think I got a really good shot of Daddy Goose with his neck thrust through the railing and trying to bite my lens. Mother Goose, on the other hand, is very calm and content to sit on the nest.

    Aside from all us humans wandering around it really is a fantastic nest site. It’s right against the South wall of the building and at the top of a grade. A perfect spot to collect warmth from the Sun and avoid runoff. And, it’s only about 50 feet to the nearest permanent pothole.

  116. frugal, there just is ‘no telling’ why anything when it comes to politics.
    The live updates from TPM, last evening, were somewhat erratic. Fast & furious for a time.
    Then stuck on a % of votes for what seemed like ages (30 minutes or more) yet the number of votes changed several times.
    [Enough time that if one had a conspiracy theory ...]

  117. Trolls are thick and heavy at TP… which brings me back to the Norse myths:

    “…trolls become defined as a particular type of being, generally held to be larger than humans and notably ugly. Numerous tales about trolls are recorded, in which they are frequently described as being extremely old, very strong, but slow and dim-witted. They are sometimes described as man-eaters and as turning to stone upon contact with sunlight.”

  118. That’s the whole thing right there, frugal.

    Most people are pretty much illiterate when it comes to current events that don’t involve the latest celebrity scandal. They don’t read papers and, if they bother with news at all, are likely to watch their local broadcast and zone out aside from weather and sports. If they bother to vote, they don’t pay much attention to anything but those awful ads. And, even then, they are only likely to believe the ads from the party they have always voted for and don’t bother to fact-check.

    Another problem that’s very apparent here in Minnesota is that the GOP does a lot of campaigning from the pulpit. When one checks the comments on a story about Batscat Bachmann one is struck by how many support her because she’s a “good Christian lady”. They aren’t getting that from any secular source.

  119. Pete, I was born and raised in Minnesota, was a resident there till 1962. I never experienced ANY religious pressure. In my little town, there were four churches: Congregational, Catholic, and two Lutheran (Norwegian and German — the Swedish Lutheran was three miles out of town). There was no proselytizing, no moralizing, only mutual respect and tolerance.

    What’s happened up that way?

    Looking forward to seeing your goose shots, btw.

  125. Found this over on TPM.

    “We owe Justice Prosser our gratitude for his more than 30 years of public service. Wisconsin voters have spoken and I am grateful for, and humbled by, their confidence and trust. I will be independent and impartial and I will decide cases based on the facts and the law. As I have traveled the State, people tell me they believe partisan politics do not belong in our Courts. I look forward to bringing new blood to the Supreme Court and focusing my energy on the important work Wisconsin residents elect Supreme Court justices to do.” — JoAnne Kloppenburg

  127. frugal,

    Even my condensed version is a mid-sized book but, in it’s simplest terms:

    The backlash against the “decadent 60′s” and the general lack of sophistication and intellectualism in rural Minnesota provided a breeding ground for the whole “moral majority” movement. There’s also more than a little xenophobia.

    These aren’t bad people. They are just terribly sheltered. Many of my friends who have spent their lives out-state have never so much as spoken with a person of color, an open homosexual, or a member of a different faith; much less anyone from another country.

    While I was eventually accepted to some extent I’ve always been a bit suspect because I’ve been to college, never attended church, and lived in other places. Needless to say, the real fundies and I don’t get along.

  128. zx, won’t there be a recount? The margin seems too slim and I can’t imagine Pricky Prosser conceding without a great big, Koch-suxer backed, recall.

  132. I post the comment and then “edit” to add the link. So there was a good 20-30 seconds when the link was missing. You fast.

  133. Okay, random question. I know in the past month (or more) some of you have been talking about your kindles; some of you got them recently; some have had one for a while.

    I’m thinking of taking the plunge. My concern is, I have a lot of books now that I never get around to reading. I’m hopeful that the convenience of the device might get me out of that slump and get me back to reading more.

    What have been your experiences?

    • zxbe, I love my Kindle DX!

      I’m reading more, and I read in more places. I usually don’t read anything but text books during the semester, but I find I enjoy reading my Kindle between classes and before bed. So many of the books I love are free downloads from various sites, and if you see a book you’d like to read, you can have it downloaded to your Kindle in about a minute — either by browsing books on the Kindle itself, or on your computer. Now when I go to the coast, I take my Kindle instead of loading up my bag with books. It’s awesome!!

  135. Pete, yeah, I hear you. When I went off to college in 1960, I had never met either a black person or a homosexual of either gender (far as I could ever tell, at least). We did have a very fine Hispanic (Mexican) family move in and buy a farm, but there were zero issues of any kind on the matter. Thanks to my dad (and counter to my mom’s best efforts), I was about as far from a religious fellow as one could get, but still I respected those who chose the other option. Still do, so long as they leave alone. I haven’t been back to Waseca County for the better part of 20 years, and the odds are I’ll never get back again. I don’t know anyone there anymore — all have either died or moved on; I have no idea what the ‘flavor’ of the place has become, although I imagine it’s very likely a lot different than it was fifty years ago.

    Speaking for myself, in the years since I left there I’ve wandered a lot, met tons of people of all races, religions, sexual persuasions, and education levels along with a huge host of different nationalities and their different races, religions, sexual persuasions, and education levels. To this day, new acquaintances still often ask me if I’m from the midwest. I tell them yep, from Minnesota, then often follow it with a story my dad liked to tell way back when about an old timer in Sibley County — Gaylord — that he knew when he was growing up, probably about 1920. The old fellow had a son who was grown and living/working in Wisconsin. After a year or two, the old guy finally went off to Wisconsin for a visit; rode the bus. When he returned a week or two later, locals asked him what he thought of Wisconsin. He said, “It’s OK, I guess, but it’s good to be back in the good ol’ U S of A!”

    Differences back in those days, in Minnesota at least, served mainly as the basis for light-hearted humor, and seldom if ever as the basis for intolerance. Today, the wheel has turned a full 180, near as I can tell. That’s sad.

    • Y’all probably know already, but Kloppenburg has declared victory in WI!!

      Did Prosser decline a re-count?

  136. Kloppy is jumping the gun. Without question, there will be a recount.

    Gov. Scott Walker said this afternoon that the spring election results show there are “two very different worlds in this state.”

    “You’ve got a world driven by Madison, and a world driven by everybody else out across the majority of the rest of the state of Wisconsin,” Walker said at a press conference in the Capitol.

    There’s Madison and Milwaukee, and then there’s real Wisconsin, with the Real Murrikans who live there.

    There’ll be charges of voter fraud, voter intimidation, and everything else Fox News, the WSJ, and Morning Joe can spew. You can almost guarantee that the wingnut hacks at places like Newsmax, Powerline and NRO are already working the New Black Panther Party angle, and will work it till it hurts.

  137. Idle curiosity, where’s Walker from, ‘real Wisconsin’, or Madison or Milwaukee?

  138. There’s Madison and Milwaukee, and then there’s real Wisconsin, with the Real Murrikans who live there.

    Same thing in Oregon, where the area from Portland south to Eugene votes heavily liberal (along with college town Ashland at the bottom of the state). Most of the other counties are bright red — and they bitch and whine because they don’t get their way in statewide elections. Uh, maybe that’s because NO ONE LIVES THERE!

  140. Raven, a few years ago they were whining that Portland got all the transportation money and why didn’t Pendleton have light rail?!! Oh, I dunno, maybe because NO ONE LIVES THERE!

  141. Zxbe ~ the only thing I know off kindles involves firewood and romance … :)
    Actually, my new droid 2 has a kindle app for download … I’ll cross the reading bridge when I get to it … ;)

  142. I flew into Pendleton once, I know exactly what you’re talking about.
    It was simply this slight smudge among the dead brown grass of the hills.

  143. I remember, years ago, a bumper sticker I saw in rural Oregon. It read, “Don’t Californicate Oregon”. I guess iat was probably directed at what some saw happening to Eugene and Portland? Libruls and stuff?

  144. frugal, no we wanted to keep development down. That wasn’t exclusively a right wing sentiment. This is from Governor Tom McCall (admittedly a Republican, but a wise and wonderful Republican back when that was possible):

    We want you to visit our State of Excitement often. Come again and again. But for heaven’s sake, don’t move here to live. Or if you do have to move in to live, don’t tell any of your neighbors where you are going.

  145. Amanda Terkel has some great analysis on the WI election.

    Significantly, 19 counties that went for Walker in the 2010 elections this time flipped and went for Kloppenburg, including LaCrosse (59 percent), Sauk (56 percent) and Dunn (56 percent).

    On a conference call with reporters Wednesday afternoon, Wisconsin Democratic Party Chairman Mike Tate was jubilant over the results, saying they represent a “watershed moment for Wisconsin and a Waterloo for Scott Walker.”

    “It should give Republicans, who are — for the moment — in the majority, pause about how they proceed in enacting Walker’s terrible budget,” he added.

  146. I can’t see owning a Kindle. I’d miss the weight, smell and texture of a book. I’d miss margin notes. Most of all, I’d miss turning the page.

  147. Badmoodman, I know what you mean about the tactile experience of reading a book. There’s something about it.

  149. I have two Kindle books on my Galaxy Tab, both about booze. I got the second one for just a few bucks, a serious study on calvados–I wanted to order a bottle from the UK and needed to make a decision. I got the book in a matter of minutes and it was very easy to look up the prospective choices.

    I appreciate the technology but I too am addicted to the physical attributes of the book.

  150. The main reason I haven’t bought a Kindle is I don’t want to play the dedicated format thing. I know it will happen eventually but I will never really give up having books.

    As to the split between Prosser and Kloppenburg, the blue collar/industry counties went right while the college counties went left. It is interesting that Wi is about evenly split between hicks and educated.

    • I thought I’d miss the physical book and the page turning, but I it never happened. I still have books, but now I won’t have boxes and boxes of books to move to my new life.

      What is “dedicated format?” I keep hearing that.

  151. Kindle 3 displays Kindle (AZW), PDF, TXT, MOBI, PRC, HTML, DOC extensions.
    Kindle DX displays Kindle (AZW), PDF, TXT, MOBI, PRC.
    Nook displays EPUB, PDF, XLS, DOC, PPT, PPS, TXT, DOCM, XLSM, PPTM, PPSX, PPSM, DOCX, XLX, PPTX.

    I’m not sure which direction the industry is headed but PDF and EPUB seem to bee catching on.

  153. In regard to a government shutdown, the good news is that (according to NPR) Social Security checks will continue to go out, and the Postal Service will continue to deliver them (and all the junk mail).

    The IRS will process electronic filings but not paper. Passports? Forget it. They interviewed one schlub who needed a passport to visit the Bahamas (he thought). On April 16. Bwahaha. Even without a shutdown you can forget that one.

  154. EPUB is a file format type. Like .PDF or .Doc. Its a way of keeping a program locked in. (Or EBook reader. Back in the old days Word and Word Perfect had distinct formats so you could only open their files with their software. This is slowly going bye bye. The AZW extension is owned by Amazon so you sort of have to go to them or a partner to get your books.

    This will change as time passes because proprietary things have a way of fading as more users want access.

    • Thanks, Hooda. I don’t go to Amazon for all my books — only the ones I purchase.

      The only PDFs I have are for school, and that is verboten on the Kindle. :)

  155. Either that or it is an online bar where people go to chat with friends and get schnozzled without having to worrying about getting an EBUI. (Electronic blogging under the influence)

    • Ebb, I never realized I was in danger of getting an EBUI. ;) I handed over the keys, I promise!

      BTW, the beverage for the evening is Chardonnay.

      • Funny. After two glasses of wine, and trying to do my reading for International Relations, I realized that I’m highlighting EVERYTHING, which is completely useless. :roll:

  159. Bad news on the goose situation. The collective has decided that there’s a risk that a child could be hurt by a ferocious Daddy Goose or get sick from the droppings so, assuming the DNR concurs, they are going to remove them and their nest. It’s unfortunate but probably for the best.

    • Poor gooses. It could have been a great learning experience for the kiddies, but I know geese can be dangerous.

  161. Canada Geese are pretty much a plague around here. They tear up the vegetation and leave shit the size of a cat’s everywhere. Since they fly over me frequently in great flocks, I am very pleased that they do not shit while flying. Crows are bad enough.

    Someone needs to thin the herd.

    • gummitch, we’re lucky over here. The geese stay in the fields and don’t haunt the parks for snacks. I’m grateful for that.

  162. On the bright side, if they move quickly the geese will probably nest again. I was thinking that they might abandon the nest the first time the lawn mower comes through anyway.

    • Hi, RC. I’m glad you finally fit in around here, but unfortunately (for someone, I guess) it’s Tartan Day.

      Heh.

  166. That’s the whole problem frugal.
    Humans keep making new nests where the critters live.

    • RC, I long to gather up our ferals, since my dog ignores cats, but I’m selling this place and can’t imagine trying to do that with a bunch of freaked out ferals in the house. :D

  169. frugal,
    Wouldn’t that be something? But…. If global warming is not reversed I am afraid much of Florida is going to be underwater.

  170. Zooey,
    Yeah , if they are not kittens then it is very tough. If my wife had her way we’d have the squirrels and raccoons in the house too!

  171. I tend to agree, frugal, and we haven’t heard from the authorities so the geese may be left alone. If they are allowed to stay I’m going to work with maintenance to stake out a “comfort zone”. Even young children can be taught to avoid an area that’s taped off. If they had just nested about anther ten feet from the concrete stairs I think there wouldn’t be as much support for moving them. However, Daddy Goose does charge anyone who sets foot on the steps and it would be tragic if someone, especially a young child, fell down said steps because of a silly goose.

  172. Old time National Lampoon map cartoon humor:

    The US yells across the Atlantic Ocean, “Hey Europe, eat my Florida!”

  173. Yeah, RC, but then as Canadians we could simply move north, probably at no expense. I could handle that.

    Hmmm. In the sixties I honestly considered heading to Canada after my deferments ran out. About ten years ago I started kicking myself for not doing it.

    • pete, I think I should buy a bigger bottle, but I’d be SO sorry in the morning…

      I’m such an alcohol wimp.

  175. “Hey, where did all the wine go…?”

    I’m sorry. Do you want a glass of this crappy boxed Chardonney?

  176. KINDLE: (Very long post; sorry. I’m about to redefine tl;dr.)

    First off, dedicated formats other than .PDF are largely meaningless. Formats that are not directly readable on Kindle (or any other e-Reader) are easily convertible using freeware such as Calibre:
    http://calibre-ebook.com/

    Thus, many of my books (classics, philosophy) are from the free e-book page of the U. of Adelaide: http://ebooks.adelaide.edu.au/ All of their files are in the .EPUB format, a fact I could care not one whit about since it is trivially easy to convert them into Kindle native .AZW files.

    The difference here is with .PDF files which largely mutilate any attempt to read them in any format other than their native one. However, in their native format you have no choice about line lengths and page sizes. So a very real concern is a screen format that will actually display .PDF files readably. The Kindle DX is the only device currently on the market for which that is true. (Even the iPad is much smaller than the DX; and it is backlit so the reading experience is not akin to reading a book.)

    I can’t see owning a Kindle. I’d miss the weight, smell and texture of a book. I’d miss margin notes. Most of all, I’d miss turning the page.

    The DX is actually heavier than most individual hardbacks. Of course, that weight differential shifts radically in the DX’s favor after you’ve loaded a few hundered Complete Works onto it.

    Except with .PDF files, you are perfectly capable of highlighting text and creating your own notes. So this issue is largely specious. IF you are like me and collect a sh!t load of texts from the Internet Archive http://www.archive.org/ , then this becomes a bit more of an issue since these texts are all .PDF’s, and (as noted) the conversion to native formats is still less than satisfactory. For that reason I keep a notepad in my kindle totebag.

    As for missing the weight of books, all I can say is move five times in seven years and see how much you miss that.

    Perhaps sometime in the near future they’ll come up with a dangly-thing like those care deoderizers, so that one can have that new (or old, in the case) book smell with one’s Kindle. Something I would genuinely like to see (because it will soothe the feelings of publishers, and thus open the market more to e-books) are dynamic covers that will display the book cover of the item being read. (Publishers recognize that as vital advertising, and resent its absence with e-books.)

    For myself, my reading has also increased. I always have between 5 and 7 items in my “current reading” list, and now I can have all of them with me at once, where ever I am. I need to process what I read, whether it is David Copperfield or “Relativization of the Theory of Computational Complexity;” so I read a while on one, and switch to another, trusting my sub-conscious to process ideas in the background. The Kindle permits me to do this. And, again, as the above mentioned article is a .PDF with a fair amount of technical symbolism in it, the DX screen allows me to read and study as though I had the journal itself in my hand.

    Being a cheap b@stard even when I wasn’t penurious, having the Kindle has inspired me to go out and collect the out-of-copyright classics that I’d never spent time with in the past. (I’d not read Melville or Dickens since high school, for example.) In the process I’ve also stumbled upon a great number of items of scholarly interest to me that I’d likely have never found had I lacked the present motivation to look. This is probably a pretty “unique to me” value, but it is a real value all the same. And it brings to mind another point:

    I detest reading at length from my computer. I want to be able to flop around where I want — out on the porch at sunset, for example — and read from something that has the size and aspect ratio of a book page. A computer screen does not do this, has far too short of a battery life for me to really get into what I’m reading on the porch (or where ever), and is considerably heavier than my DX to boot.

    Finally, the manufacture of paper is extremely resource intensive, and is particularly damaging in terms of GHG’s. After 20 — 25 book purchases, you have begun to significantly reduce your impact on the environment. (I have, for example, cancelled all of my paper subscriptions to journals I receive for my memberships in professional associations. I download the articles I want and read them at my leisure.)

  177. Zooey, I offer no insights on issues of impulse control (that’s your problem), but I can highly recommend Black Box Wine:
    http://www.blackboxwines.com/

    Even my snootier friends like this stuff. It is much better than your average table wine and a very reasonable price.

    The prejudice against box wine is going to have to yield to facts, I’m afraid.

    • Via Feministe, why is this guy single…?

      If you’re reasonably tall (5’6-6’, no more than that because, while I don’t mind being eye to eye with you, I won’t ever be looking up to you), you’re passionate and intelligent so as to be good company, sexually liberated, and attractive – really attractive, fat chics need not apply (hehe, I’m so self-amusing). Capable of holding a steady job but without making it your #1 priority – since it could interfere with our sexual activities. Family oriented but not anytime soon, rather when you are 30+ at least, open to spontaneous sexual activities (you know, outdoors sex, the odd 3-some with a cutie we pick up somewhere or one of your girlfriends), likes the outdoors (nudity optional), and doesn’t complain when I go fishing with the guys.

      Must be ready to have children only after 30 and proving yourself to be a faithful wife and a loving woman, prepared for the duties of a good mother, have class and know when it’s time to speak up and when it’s NOT the time to do so, instead of a stuck-up naggy b!tch who can’t shut up, sociable, know how to please the sexual drive of your partner (little things such as giving me a call when you’ve gotten a new set of sexy lingerie to surprise me), and know that gifts are little treats and rewards, and not a never-ending desire to be pampered.

      If you can accept that I’m responsible for taking charge and my decisions will be final, don’t take yourself too seriously and thinks the world of me. You must be under 31 (that’s the expiration date for most women anyway), and have good spending habits, no ridiculous credit card debts and a sense of home economy; I’m not planning on changing my excellent lifestyle, and I plant to eventually be able to give my children an excellent education – and that’s not possible without good savings and planning. This will also help teaching them to earn their own achievements, respect their parents, and not be spoiled brats. You should also understand that pets are simple money pits that only serve as something lonely women occupy themselves with so that they don’t have to connect with their husbands. I’m attracted to all kinds of women, redheads, brunettes, black, white, latinas, you name it, as long as they’re attractive. Not attracted to fat women, and that includes the infamous “curvy” (a word that used to mean actual curves, not fat), and “a few extra pounds,” regardless of your supposed “inner beauty.” Sorry :)

      Too bad I’m past my expiration date. Damn!

  178. Oh Gary I hate to disagree with you but that’s what I’m drinking and I think it’s kind of awful. The price is fair, but it smells sort of off.

  179. Zooey that guy will be single as long as he lives. There is no amount of plastic-lined wine that would induce some woman to sleep with him. Why is it that the men that are so concerned about a woman’s appearance are usually the ones that are so unattractive? Do these people not have mirrors?

  180. I can’t vouch for how long its been sitting in sunlight at the store, OIMF. If it were simply a matter of my tastes, I might be less inclined to defend it. But if it really has some such awful smell, then something has gone wrong with age, storage or shipment, which will destroy any wine. This is not a characteristic of the brand.

    (Friend of mine and I bought a bottle of wine at a local store (improperly shelved, and sitting in the sun), and really regretted it. She was making an heroic effort to struggle through it, until I had to speak up: “It tastes like canned peas.” Her face had a peculiar, puckered expression for a moment until she spit the wine back into her glass and we threw the remaining bottle out.)

    • I’ve met men like that here in Idaho. Totally clueless about what smelly dogs they were, but very high standards for “their” wimmin folk.

      It’s truly astonishing.

  183. Zooey, not only will that guy be single for life but he’ll also be stuck paying for sex if he’s that lucky. It sounds like he would probably call Marylin Monroe “fat” too.

    • pete, that’s the kind of guy who is totally surface, and they will pay dearly for all that “hot & pretty.”

      Heh.

  184. random, what a beautiful looking cat!

    Do you think the Sharks have it in ‘em tonight? I think they are tired.

  185. “…fat chics need not apply (hehe, I’m so self-amusing)”

    That is a very telling line – tells me he’s never ever been with a woman – self amusing is all he’ll ever get.

  186. Could be age or storage Gary. I’ve purchased old Chardonney is the past and been badly disappointed. My husband has a degree in viticulture and until he explained to me that older isn’t better, especially with whites, I had no clue. I’ll give Black Box a second try since this was my first purchase. Funny how marriage can be sort of symbiotic. My degree is compsci, he’s the computer guy, I’m the farmer.

  188. random – I don’t have cable – listening on line. They’re a tired bunch. The 6-1 win the other night was a good game – too bad they couldn’t have some of those for tonight.

    Hurray – Sharks score!

  189. Ebb, “self abusing” might be more accurate

    Zooey, you know my delicate sensibilities wouldn’t permit to type that truth!

  191. They’re playing like the B-team – Sharks are dragging – they need to focus!

  193. Zooey – Every hockey team wants an “Auntie” Niemi – the Sharks have him – but aren’t playing him.

    Oh, damn – the Sharks are on the short end of 6-1.

    I may have to stop listening to let my blood pressure lower to a safe measurement ;>

  195. I certainly don’t want to overstate the quality of my pallate, OIMF. So while I’ve had good experiences with BB, what I found most impressive was the praise from friends who really do act (at least) the part of cultivated wine drinkers. They tried several different styles, and were greatly pleased. This wasn’t great wine, but very solid table wine.

    So I’m hoping that your experience is some kind of outlier. Perhaps on some other occassion you can find a friend to buy some from a different location (this last might be important, so that you can eliminate as many factors that spoiled the one you’ve been drinking from) than this box came from and give it a second go? If it still comes out poorly — well, I got nuthin’.

  197. Ebb: “Tidy up” — I had a couple bags of ‘dad stuff’ that I was planning to sort through that I moved from the living room into a closet. I mentioned to the caller that I was in the midst of getting prepped to move, and the caller said she would pass that info on to the agent.

    I also straightened up my dad’s wonky recliner so that it at least looked like a functional chair.

    I’ve no idea how the prospectives were impressed, for good or ill, but they did spend a moment out on the porch admiring the view. That porch and view are definitely the selling points for this house. I like this area, but it is that porch and view that I will miss about this domicile.

    (Despite be squarely in the midst of a housing development, the other houses that are visible are quite unobtrusive, and you’ve a lovely straight line view all the way out to Granite Mountain. I love sitting out there with an adult beverage and my Kindle, the sliding door open so the cats can come out and enjoy the “big screen TV”, and read in the mild afternoon to twilight.)

  199. “big screen TV” –

    Mel sits on the sill, face up against the window screen and keeps a keen eye
    on all the happenings in the court yard (three floors down). He doesn’t really want to go out the window – there are folk who walk (small dogs) and Mel isn’t fond of the canine.

    • My old dog’s vision isn’t what it used to be, so she barks at the sliding glass door a bit more than usual these days. She was barking this morning, and I went to see what was the problem. One of the ferals, a gorgeous orange tabby, was sunny itself in the parking lot.

      I said, “What are you barking at? That’s a cat.” Honey looked at me as if to say, “Oh?” and then walked away for nap time.

      Honey is amazing in her ability to completely ignore the existence of cats. Even when (or especially when) they are puffed up and hissing, she simply does not acknowledge them. :D

  200. Honey sounds like a honey of a dog – ignoring cats. Was she raised with cats and thinks she may be one?

    ——-

    Speaking of cats – Gary’s yours are as gorgeous as the scenery from the porch.
    Your orange cat is Mel’s twin – just dip its tail in a bit of white paint and they are truly twins!

    • I don’t know, Ebb. I adopted her from the humane society, and know nothing of her history, except that she was probably kicked around by a man in a ball cap — judging by her past reactions to them. I’ve gotten her over that for the most part. She will try to kill any dog in her vicinity, even if they are twice her size, which is awkward at times. Otherwise, she’s a real sweetie. :)

  201. Dogs are pack animals and need the “alpha” to come check things out, and assure them that the world is OK.

    I went to visit a friend in Chicago once who was keeping her sister’s dog, an odd Lab/Akita mix named “Beezer.” Beezer had met me before, but not in this friend’s condo, and commenced barking endlessly. The friend was being dignified and trying to ignore it. But I hit a point where I just couldn’t take it any more. I turned and ROARED at Beezer, “THAT’S ENOUGH! You’re not the Big Dog here, I AM!!”

    Beezer literally rolled over and peed on herself. Rather more of a reaction than I anticipated, and my friend was less than pleased about that last part. But for the remainder of the time she was keeping Beezer, there were no further problems.

    • That’s the thing people don’t understand about dogs, Gary — the need to make sure they know who the “big dog” is. Once Honey understood that, we got along much better, and she relaxed quite a bit.

  203. Mel was literally thrown from a moving car – on a sweltering August afternoon.
    He was so shaken up – we tried to get him – he’d just run and hide in bushes.
    A neighbor and I set out food and water for him.
    After about six weeks he’d allow us to at least get within six feet. All the while talking to him.
    Then one day – he was my bestest pal! As usual I asked him how life was treating him – he looked at me and meowed! Corny, yes – it told me I was a trusted by him.

  204. It is very difficult for me to understand the cruelty some folk heap on animals.
    The thought of just ‘throwing away’ an animal would never ever occur to me.

    We are, generally, a very shallow nation. Trendy – and the animals pay for it.
    Pure breeds – everyone has to have one.
    Look at the pot bellied pig phase. So many people had no idea how to care for them – ended up at the animal shelter.

    Around here – no rabbit, duck or chicken can be adopted around Easter time. People don’t do their homework and the animals turn out to be too much to handle. Many were returned shortly after Easter. So no ‘emotional’/holiday adoptions. There’s a waiting period for people to truly consider adoption.

  205. My Groucho is a feral who decided to come inside. She is extremely shy around people; to the best that I can figure, she just decided I was a funny looking cat.

    In any event, all three are rescues straight off the street.

    I’ve worked with TNR projects both here and back in Carbondale. Groucho is from that latter bunch, before I’d managed to catch and spay her Dam, “Queenie”, who was the matron for the entire colony in the trailer park where I was living. By the time I was done, I’d caught and fixed every feral there, and ended the population explosion on the spot.

    A good resource on community/feral cats:
    http://www.alleycat.org/

  206. I don’t know – having just read, over at TP, that the Donald has been hoisted on shoulders and paraded as the number one GoOPer pick – simply for regurgitating the Obama is Kenyan crap…
    there’s very little hope for this country to regain intelligence enough to keep it afloat.

  209. Goodnight! Gary. As always great spending the evening with you and the cats!
    Restful slumber!

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