The Watering Hole, Thursday, May 17th, 2012: The Republican War on Women, Part GGPLX**

**GGPLX = Googolplex

Sad to say, I wasted way too much time yesterday arguing with idiots (see below) on the ThinkProgress thread about Kansas Governor Brownback signing legislation allowing pharmacists to refuse to fill a prescription for a medication which, in the pharmacist’s view, could result in an abortion.

An article in the Kansas City Star quotes the bill’s sponsor, State Rep. Lance Kinzer, as stating, “…the right to an abortion does not include within it the right to require someone else to participate in or facilitate your abortion.” [So, is a woman supposed to perform the abortion herself? In Mississippi, apparently one State Representative, Bubba Carpenter (R-Idiot) thinks so.] The KC Star article goes on to say that “Kinzer has also said that the bill is intended to cover the abortion drug RU-486, not contraceptive medications — although he would be OK if conscience protections extended that far.” [Yeah, I’ll bet he’d be more than okay with that!]

Luckily, not all Republicans are against women’s reproductive health. GOPChoice, a pro-choice Republican group, says on its website,

“this bill exists under the assumption that a doctor’s prescription may jeopardize a pregnancy, and a pharmacist is better equipped to determine whether or not an individual can safely take said medication…The bill also raises the question, “How does the pharmacist know the individual is pregnant?” Either the pharmacist must have access to private medical information, or receives the legal allowance to make medical assumptions based on appearance.”

– and –

“The radical conscience clause measure states that health professionals cannot be forced to supply any prescription or device they, “reasonably believes may result in the termination of a pregnancy.””

To me, the key phrase here is “reasonably believes.” Just how reasonable is someone who is allowed to let his or her religious beliefs override medical training and scientific fact?

And now, just a brief selection of the commentary at TP:

Vincent: “Pharmacists have the right to refuse to fill ANY prescription. They have to exercise professional judgment on a case by case basis. Patients abuse, doctors prescribe incorrectly or frivolously, some patients fill the Rx and turn around and sell it on the black market. Just because most pharmacists work where you buy shampoo and toilet paper doesn’t make them less of a health care professional. The government getting involved on either side, whether requiring pharmacists to fill or allowing them to refuse, is intrusive.”

My response: “Vincent, there’s a big difference between a pharmacist refusing to fill a prescription because the doctor prescribed incorrectly, and a pharmacist refusing to fill a prescription because he/she feels that filling it is against their personal beliefs. And I have to point out, this ‘conscience clause’ SOLELY applies to a medication that ONLY WOMEN need.”

Greg: “There are several types of birth control , and they will not be outlawed! Chill!”

My response: “First, the birth control pill is not (yet) being outlawed, but its dispensation is being left to the moral whims of your local pharmacist. If access to birth control of any type is up to one’s pharmacist, why aren’t condoms behind the pharmacy counter, where one’s pharmacist can determine who gets to buy them? And, since the birth control pill is often prescribed for other women’s health problems, not just for birth control, why should it be up to the pharmacist, rather than the DOCTOR, to decide whether or not to dispense the prescription?”

Greg: “It will never be outlawed. (the pill) But a drug that serves as an abortion pill or could be used as such could be. Right now it is not , but the pharmacist is given the choice whether or not to provide it, which means some WILL and some will not. So quit trying to project your insane radical belief that if everyone doesn’t share your morals or values they are trying to harm YOU in some way. GEEZ!!”

My response: “Greg, I am way beyond the point where I need birth control, so this issue does not harm me in any way. So quit trying to project your insane belief that I think they’re trying to harm ME in some way. And what is so insanely radical about believing that, if my doctor prescribes the birth control pill for, say treatment of ovarian cyst (one of the pill’s uses), a pharmacist shouldn’t have the right to refuse to fill that prescription?”

And I loved this one, but simply couldn’t respond to such idiocy:

“glad that Gov Brownback is defending the constitutional right of these pharmacies to run their own business the way they see fit — girls who want drugs to kill their babies can go stand in line at WalMart & buy them there.”

Oy! Attitudes like this may be explained in this article that I found by chance. Enjoy!

This is our daily open thread — feel free to discuss this topic, or whatever’s on your mind!

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149 thoughts on “The Watering Hole, Thursday, May 17th, 2012: The Republican War on Women, Part GGPLX**

  1. Imagine this scenario:
    I’m sorry Rep. Kinzer, as you pharmacist I’m not going to refill your prescription for VIAGRA because I think you’re already a big enough dick as it is.

  2. My attitude on the matter(s) of contraception, abortion, gay marriage, and all the other massive intrusions of Republican “philosophy” into the lives and attitudes of We the People is extremely simple: if you don’t approve of contraception, don’t use it; if you don’t approve of abortion, don’t have one; if you don’t approve of gay marriage, don’t marry one of your own gender. There is no legislative agenda in place by anyone of any persuasion to demand participation in any of the above, only the implicit permission to proceed if you care to. Personal decisions are implicit aspects of governmental non-interference in personal affairs, and a longtime hallmark of the American Constitutional experience — a hallmark that’s currently under long term attack by American political freaks and nutcases (“conservatives”, in a word).

    It’s nigh on impossible for me to believe that any portion of We the People can be so stupid as to believe that it’s reasonable and proper for the government to limit the scope of personal behaviors that threaten no one, and yet Republicans in support of such idiotic fantasies constantly garner more than ten votes in general elections everywhere. What a sad statistic that last one truly is.

    • Just another prime example of how Republicans say they’re conservative and for limited government, unless it’s the ability to limit women’s control of their bodies, and their choices.
      Assholes.

  3. My response to this bill is: if the pharmacist refuses to fill the prescription, then change pharmacies and encourage others to do the same. Money talks and the rest walks. Boycotts work. There usually is more than one pharmacy in town and there are mail order pharmacies.

  4. From the ‘Hitting the Nail on the Head’ Department, last night’s Daily Kos Open thread for night owls: The newest birther conspiracy:

    “Dreams From My Real Father,” a 97-minute film narrated by an Obama impersonator, weaves the narrative that Obama’s grandfather wasn’t a furniture salesman but an undercover CIA agent who convinced Barack Obama Sr. to marry his teenage daughter to hide the fact that she was impregnated by a 55-year-old communist named Frank Marshall Davis. […]

    The film has been favorably reviewed by WND’s Jerome R. Corsi, who wrote an entire book arguing that Obama’s birth certificate is a fake and that he was really born in Kenya and ineligible to be president of the United States.

    […]
    Hearing about things like this (and how very, very prevalent they are, when it comes to politics, science, or anything else that somebody, somewhere, finds personally objectionable), the only conclusion one can come to is that humankind is, for all our preening, made up of some damn stupid individuals—and that our ancestors are unbelievably damn lucky to have managed to form governments or civilizations at all, given what they had to work with.

    I can’t imagine how many of our primate ancestors made the very early discovery that fire equals good, only to have their heads caved in by fellow primates that were certain fire was a plot by the primate devil and/or the primate Illuminati. How many thousands of years went by before the whole “let’s use fire to keep warm” or “hey, let’s cook this damn meat to make it less putrid” thing took off to the point where the vaguely bipedal practitioners didn’t just get torn to bits for suggesting the idea? That is impressive enough, but then to have gone on to develop bronze, or cement, or Nintendo systems—now that took some true miracles. No, the astonishing thing about civilization is that it can withstand such a very large percentage of crackpots, during any given era, who are bent on knocking down the whole thing because it conflicts with their own personal motivations or notions of which particular bogeymen are waiting behind which particular corners.
    […]

    Amen.

    • AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

      I have unchecked the “Notify me of follow-up comments via email” countless times and I am still plagued with notifications.

      Any thoughts?

      • Can you put a rule on your inbox that shitcans all emails spam from WP?

    • Sadly, even Jesus Howard Christ can’t repair the stoopid that lurks in Mr. Quist.

  5. Today, for the first time ever, I feel like an oppressed minority.

    I have a dream…

  6. My latest take on marriage…

    The government should recognize no marriages. They should only recognize civil unions, and define them to allow a man/woman, woman/woman, man/man to get “unioned.” Marriage should be relegated back to the church and as such has no legal standing whatsoever. People would be free to get married but not have a civil union (dumb choice, but they’re free to make it). People would free to have a civil union and not get married (great choice, and they’re free to make it).

    • I’ve long thought marriage should be nothing more than a religious adjunct to the fundamental legal ‘civil union’ status. Anyone (of legal age) who cares to should be able to be ‘unioned’, and anyone who cares to add religious baggage to the legal union should be able to get ‘married’ by a religious prelate of whatever sort or choice. Marriage is secondary, i.o.w., NOT primary.

    • True. Those that wish to preserve government sanctioned “traditional” marriage only should also be willing to give up the special status that government programs give to spouses and any legal rights and protections awarded to married couples only. It’s the only way their narrow minded opinion could ever be reconciled with the Constitution.

    • How about returning to common law where 5 years living together can be considered a legal marriage. Pennsylvania used to recognize common law unions so much so that my former “common law” husband could have demanded a divorce from me. It didn’t cost me anything to get into the relationship but it would have cost me to get out of it. Luckily, he was just as happy to move on as I was without any protests.

  7. Sen. Brownback, Vincent and Greg will never be pregnant. They cannot possibly understand why this issue is so important to women.

  8. Bibi’s negative influence:

    In a global survey, poll respondents now ranked Israel “third among nations perceived as having a negative influence on the world.” Israel was beaten by only Iran and North Korea. But in America, support for Israel is actually growing, presumably because of the religious bonds between the settler movement, Greater Israel, and the Christianist right. Israel has lost European support in startling ways:

    Negative attitudes were also recorded in France (65%), Germany (69%), Britain (68%), Australia (65%) and Canada (59%). Support for Israel also declined in China, India and Russia.

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4230395,00.html

  9. The French-German relationship summed up in 40 seconds. That little Merkel nudge, just short of a shove, is a hoot:

    • The Germans must love that – they don’t even need to send tanks through the Ardennes anymore, their womenfolk have it handled already. What Count von Schlieffen couldn’t do, Angela Merkel’s elbow can.

  10. Save California, Pro-Family Group, Demands Kids Skip School on Harvey Milk Day

    The right-wing pro-family group Save California has made the daunting request that probably won’t go over well in San Francisco. Those hatemongers demand parents take their kids out of school on May 22 — Harvey Milk Day — so youngsters aren’t subjected to curriculum, lessons, or positive information about Harvey Milk, whom they offensively refer to as a “teen predator.”

    • “Hello, I’m Harvey Milk and I’m here to recruit you!”

      Heh, even from the grave…feel the power!!

    • I watched a documentary on Harvey Milk about a month ago. Other than knowing that he was a city council member in San Francisco, I really didn’t know much about him even though they made a movie about him. It was a fascinating look at the good that a single person can do. Anyone would be well served to learn about this man. It is really something to be able to affect as many lives for the good as this man did.

    • I can’t imagine a better way to make children aware of, and thankful for, Mr. Milk than to give them a day off from school. Idiots.

  11. In 2004, all I heard from dedicated Bush-humpers was, “We don’t change presidents in a time of war.” This country is still at war, although one less war, thanks to President Obama, so those same people are saying the same thing, and completely support the President.

    Oh wait…

    • You forget…. those other Presidents in the time of war were white….

    • So elections don’t matter if they happen during time of war? I’m sorry, but that is a very, very unwise attitude to have. It’s one thing to say, “My country, right or wrong.” It’s something else altogether to insist that you must support whichever president happens to be in office at the time. To do that is to abrogate your civic responsibility to hold your elected officials accountable when they do something wrong, like, oh, I don’t know, lie about the threat some other country poses in order to enact regime change (which is a specific violation of international law.) Iraq was never a threat to us, no matter how many times people tried to say, “We can’t take that chance.” There was never any chance that they were a threat to us, and the only thing people who believed so were afraid of was their own imaginations. Shame on ANYONE who supported the invasion of Iraq when the REAL evidence was quite clear, at the time, that Bush was lying!

      And that damn “Notify me of follow-up comments” box is still checking itself. I made absolutely sure I unchecked it this time, so I better not get any e-mails telling me about further comments.

      • That’s something I have noticed about America that I don’t notice in my place of birth or other countries. The moniker ‘commander-in-chief’ gets bandied about in order to intimidate people who do consider that the president should be accountable to the electorate. ‘Are you not supporting the c-in-c in a time of war?’ Why the hell should you unless you are an active duty soldier, when conceivably you should respond to orders from superiors? Seems to me there are so many ex-service people in the populace and that they seem to not be able to shake that learned dependence and servility. They’ve forgotten that the SPOTUS works for *them* not the other way around! And that’s another problem – your military is too f***ing big.

        I think Americans have lost sight of what it means to hold people accountable – if you are in a perpetual state-of-war then the population gets divided into three groups: the armed forces, veterans of the armed forces and future recruits or reservists. No citizens left to hold anyone accountable

        And if I get any more emails – I’m deleting my WP account.

      • Alternatively, the GOP could always propose to suspend elections whenever ther’s a war on…? There’s a name for that ….. er …. er…

    • My favourite bumper sticker was: “Don’t change horsemen in the midst of an apocalypse – Bush/Cheney/War/Pestilence 2004

    • And the BushitCO suckups had it completely wrong. The best election is one that shitcans a president who got us into the war in the first place.

  12. Okay, all y’all. I checked the forums, and apparently receiving email every time you comment is a wonderful new feature offered by WordPress, for which you must opt-out, rather than opt-in. Grrr…..I let them know how we feel about kind of stupidity.

    Two way of handling this:

    Un-check the fucking box every single time; OR
    Un-subscribe to emails from WordPress. You can find the unsubscribe thing at the bottom of your hundreds of emails or here. Just click on “settings” next to Delivery Frequency.

    I turned off the “notify me of new comments” box completely, so let me know if it works.

    • The, very, annoying part of all this – one must go in each day to ‘turn it off’.

    • I don’t understand why everyone continues to have a problem with this or what I am doing any different from the rest of you, but I am not getting endless emails notifications. I did a few weeks ago when they made the change, but I was able to turn them off the first day and I don’t get them anymore.

      Although, I don’t tend to log out of WP until it boots me out once a month.

      • Not logging out is probably the key, LL. I’m not getting the emails either and I don’t log out, but I thought it was because I’m an administrator of the blog.

        • I don’t log out. When/if the e-mails start popping up I need to go through that annoying ritual of going in each day and turn off the notification.

    • I think your turning off that box is working as I’m not getting any e-mails for the blog (even though I had checked the box earlier today to get them).

      It would be nice if there was a way for there to be the best of both worlds. I rely upon the e-mails to keep up on all the goings on here. (It’s safer to have my e-mail open at work than the blog all day.)

  13. Go to the bottom, of an e-mail you’ve received from theZoo:
    You’ll see: Want less email? Modify your Subscription Options.
    click and it will bring up what you’re ‘following’.
    click on TheZoo and a red ‘delete’ will pop up. Click the delete and it will stop the e-mails (for the day).

    (they don’t make this easy — curse you WP)

      • Purely a guess: they are inundated with the we really dislike the “new and improved” system.

        • I’m surprised by the number of other commenters who LOVE getting the emails. I’m guessing they don’t have a blog that gets as many comments as this one. Or they get validation by having a packed email box.

          • I don’t follow very many blogs. This one’s the most active, but I do actually like getting the e-mails as I can keep up easier with what’s going on without having the blog open. (Boss sees e-mail open doesn’t mind. Boss see’s blog open, and he can get a little annoyed.)

            • Okay, Critters and Zoosters.

              What’s it going to be? Zxbe actually uses the email system, and we really like him around here. We can leave it the way it is now, and we don’t have to deal with emails, or I can turn it back on and zxbe can keep up with things, and we would just un-check or un-subscribe.

              Discuss.

    • Oops! I think he said the two stupidest things he’s ever said.

      First he said that only “wackos” think that we are depleting natural resources. Then he went off on a bizarre rant about how said wackos don’t complain about “what lions do”. Here’s the deal:

      There are around 50 thousand lions left and they actually improve the environment by eating, mostly, weaklings. There are 7 billion people and we destroy everything in pour paths. Of course, Lushbo’s worshipers are too stupid to understand the difference even if they believe the numbers which, coming from a “librul” they would not believe.

  14. You’d think people in the media, the mainstream media, could get a celebrity’s name pronounced correctly when announcing they died and waxing about the star.

    Donna SUMMER. Not, SUMMERS

    I’m talking to you, Martin BashirS and Dylan RatiganS.

  15. (from VoteVets.org)

    If you’ve a mind to sign:

    At a recent fundraiser, the Colorado Congressman said, “I don’t know whether Barack Obama was born in the United States of America. I don’t know that. But I do know this, that in his heart, he’s not an American. He’s just not an American.”

    “Tell Rep. Mike Coffman that Veterans don’t use their service as an excuse to smear the Commander-in-Chief. American exceptionalism is about holding ourselves to a higher standard. If Rep. Coffman believes in that, it’s time he ends the smears and starts leading by example.”

    • For some reason all I hear is: “he’s black”. No one who is black could possibly be the legitimate President of the United States. Real Americans are white.”

      • “Real Americans are white.”

        According to today’s news, not for long.

        • And 5 will get you 10 that there will be more than a few murders perpetrated by the freaks who can’t stand the fact that there are people who don’t look just like them. FAUX”News” will herald it as the final sign of the apocalypse. I’m actually looking forward to how they’re going to phrase the inevitable pronouncement that, because we elected a black guy, now the “others” are outbreeding “us”.

      • But I’ve also heard RWNJs sneer that “he’s really mostly white” which seems more than a little odd given that Obama’s dad was African and his mother a white girl from Kansas. To me that looks like 50/50. If his father had been African-American one might argue that one of his ancestors was most likely raped by a white man, but this isn’t the case. Not to mention that it’s completely ingenuous to suggest that anyone looking at the President doesn’t see him as a Black man.

    • I don’t know whether Rep Mike Coffman wears a pillow case and rides around his neighbourhood yee hawing at the no-white folks he passes. , I don’t know that. But I know this, that he’s is a hooting, hollering, pillow case wearing, bigot.

      Wow, it is easy to blow chunks out of your a**, isn’t it?

      • Eureka!

        Actually, it’s a chrome extension called Slick RSS. Add the RSS feeds you want to track, and you get a discrete little number on the browser toolbar when there’s new stuff to read. Click the button, and it takes you to a nice summary of the posts. Click on a post and takes you right to WP to that comment. This works.

    • TtT, who would “she” be? (the link doesn’t link)
      Good to read the Turtles were spared an upbringing in the hell-hole TX.

    • I grew up in Texas, but at a time where we actually learned about unions and science and evolution. Religion was kept out of the classroom.

      • I will make it a policy not to hire any science/engineering grads from any Texas school – their degrees will not be accredited by me.

        • I graduated with a BS in Microbiology from Texas Tech. And spent 20+ years working in environmental labs. Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater…

          • Depends on when – if a kid comes in with a degree from Texas from the last 5 years – then they didn’t get an education in science. If I open a fortune-telling booth and need a psychic, I’ll reconsider my position

  16. You know how sometimes you’re just minding your own business when a Lamborghini pulls over, a horse in a bikini jumps out and someone molests the horse with a rubber glove on a trombone? I hate it when that happens.

    http://www.dudelol.com/404.swf

    • WHOAH! Now that appeared to be tending towards NSFW……

      Happens all the time in my neighbourhood that does. Well in a Prius – it is the Left Coast after all…. and it’s a fleece bikini, …..well a fleece and a flannel shirt …. and its a dude, in cargo shorts and thongs….. and it’s raining.

    • Mind you I’d recognise Courtney Stodden anywhere – with or without a horse’s head. Especially if it’s a fake Lamborghini which it looks like it is.

  17. My, junior in high school, niece just e-mailed:

    My science textbook just used the bible as a factual reference

    (this is Santa Cruz, CA so we see the extent of the idiocy from TX when they are in charge of ‘text books’)

    • Becasue he hasn’t been charged in the phone hacking scandal yet?

      • If they came on a did that live, perp-walked him off the set – I bet his ratings would go up then for the rerun on Sunday.

    • I wish we could compare those ratings to Jennifer Granholm’s, but we don’t get Current’s stats.

      Rachel’s 25-54 demo is almost as much as Hannity’s, but his overall was more than double hers. Makes you wonder how many of Hannity’s older viewers have fallen asleep with the TV on. He does crappy considering the lead in Billo gives him. Almost a million seniors are still awake enough to change the channel or turn the TV off when his show starts. :D

    • “And flush toilets too! Come on Grandad you old git! Oh and you flew to New York from Chicago? OMG ROTFLMAO!”

  18. No e-mails from The Zoo today. What y’all did fixed it!

    Zxbe, do I have to ‘sign in’ to Google to use that RSS thing?

  19. George Zimmerman news…

    According to the report, prior to the shooting Zimmerman had been prescribed Adderall and Temazepam, medications that can cause side effects such as agitation and mood swings, but in fewer than 10 percent of patients. – ABC News Exclusive

    Now we know how Zimmerman lost all that weight. Adderall is basically speed.

    • BTW, all the news I’m hearing on the radio today is reporting that Trayvon Martin had evidence of marijuana in his system, but not a peep about the serious drugs Zimmerman was on.

      Wonder why?

    • I don’t think I can say anything else about that case now that the arrest is done – I don’t think that it will now be possible for Martin to get justice nor Zimmerman to get a fair trial …. and that’s a tragedy in itself.

  20. Wayne has one tweet on Ed so far, during a promo-break 15 minutes in.

    • Thanks, House. That was the only one I saw tonight. I’ll put it up on my blog as part of my “Adventures in Tweeting” series. Meanwhile, I’m trying to get someone to answer a question about whether or not he is in favor of unchecked greed. If he answers, I may have more tweets to add to the post. :)

        • Oh, I will. He came back and we had more back-and-forth, but another guy chimed in and pretty much said my idea to tax income ABOVE $100 million was “Marxism.” Then he tried to say the Constitution didn’t prohibit unchecked greed. Not directly, but it does give Congress the power to regulate for the benefit of the general Welfare. I will provide a link after I collect them all into a post, but people who subscribe to my blog ( ;) ) will know when I post it. :)

    • Leftside Annie got one at :44. That was all tonight!

      Ezra Klein in for Rachel tonight.

  21. Romney doesn’t know what he said, but whatever he said, he stands behind it.

    OMG!! He actually said it! :lol:

    • Come January 2013, regardless of which man takes the oath of office, we’ll remain a country with a manic enthusiasm for the military. Rather than a president who urges us to abhor endless war, we’ll be led by a man intent on keeping us oblivious to the way we’re squandering our nation’s future in fruitless conflicts that ultimately compromise our core constitutional principles.

      I fear that is a true sense of the ‘coming attractions’.

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