The Watering Hole: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 Post-Debate Detox

Happy Hump Day!

Ok, The Presidential Debates, Round Two, is now history.

Who won?

Obamny?

Rombama?

The President certainly brought his A game this time, and closed on a slam-dunk with bringing up Romney’s 47% remark behind closed doors.

The moderator did a credible job of moving things along, but could have been better in cutting Romney off after the TV monitor showed his time was up, then not allowing Obama a chance to rebut.

Romney’s Etch-a-Sketch was in full play…again…in this author’s perspective.

What do you think? Think the President regained his Mo-Jo? Think Romney will continue to add to his momentum? Think Fox News will go apoplectic over Mitt telling the President, basically, to not interrupt Romney’s interruption, that he’ll get his turn?

OPEN THREAD.

GO FOR IT.

MAKE MY DEI.

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179 thoughts on “The Watering Hole: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 Post-Debate Detox

  1. Election 2012 is in the bag!

    Honey Boo Boo Endorses Obama

    In further dubious celebrity endorsement news, Honey Boo Boo has endorsed Obama.

    If you don’t know who Honey Boo Boo is, you have led a uniquely charmed life and you need to go back to it, posthaste. And take me with you.

    But for the rest of us, this seems only logical.

    • I didn’t know who Honey Boo Boo was until I saw the name mentioned in the headlines of a supermarket gossip sheet while waiting to pay for my groceries. From the sounds of it, I’m not missing much.

    • Speaking as one who has obviously “led a uniquely charmed life”, I checked out the link and quickly learned the undercurrent reason for the “charmed” part in the line which begins, “She is 7 and accustomed to being on reality television . . .” Reality TV. My single solitary experience with it came maybe a decade ago, or three years before HBB was born. It was the time I accidentally watched maybe 3 or 4 minutes of “Survivor” during which my sole comment was “What the fuck is THIS?” — spoken while hunting for the remote channel-changer. That was within weeks of the time our cable company tried to raise our monthly rates by $3 (from 12 all the way to 15) and we told them where to stuff it.

      Life can be sweet, i.o.w.

    • I used to ride in a vanpool full of ‘reality TV’ devotees. The consequence of not having an actual real life of their own, I guess.

    • Never heard of HBB until some remarks were made comparing her audience to the first night of the RNC (I think). I remain blissfully ignorant and will do my utmost to remain so. It was bad enough that I inadvertently learned what a Snookie was.

  2. Romney is a guy who never went on a real job interview. He keeps telling people how awesome he’d be if we hired him, but he’s not offering specifics that pertain to the job description.

    • And he said he started a small business… I don’t think his definition of a small business matches what the 99% would consider a small business.

        • Yes…..millions to start his ponzi scheme. If you need a college education or want to start a new business venture, just borrow from your parents. They surely have a portfolio worth millions……like all Americans do

    • There is one photo that has a picture of a very angry woman sitting in the front row. My guess is that she isn’t voting for either of these men. She will either write-in her candidate or she won’t be voting at all.

    • Exactly! I had to wait far too long to hear those words but I feel a lot better now. I’ll be ecstatic if President Obama now finds the right moment to ask Mittens; “were you lying then or are you lying now?”

      • IMO it would be as effective and not nearly as combative (which turns people off) to say more like: “Well you know you said the opposite while you were campaigning presumably because you thought saying so would get you a primary vote or two – would you like to come up here and debate yourself for a bit on this issue? Mitt last March v Mitt tonight? I’d appreciate it if you did, I’d like to have a drink of water and straighten my tie again.

  3. I said last night Romney’s answer on women and equal pay was lame. Here’s why: he begins by telling a story of not apparently knowing any smart conservative women, and having his staff return only male candidates. He sent them back to look for women. It was the sexist equivalent of “I can’t have any illegals; I’m running for President for heaven’s sake.”

    He is running on his business record, but he wasn’t aware of women’s workplace issues until he became governor of Massachusetts? No one in the Romney campaign for Governor or Senator, no one from his circle of Bain capitalists knew any qualified women? No one on his staff ever hung out with any, hired any, were friends with any women on a professional level, or served on boards or committees with qualified women? So they went to “the binders of women”? Try inserting “African-American” into his quote instead of women and see the insult.

  4. Low point of the evening for WIllardRat?
    When he had to be corrected, by the moderator, when he falsely stated that Obama was lying: “I want to make sure we get that for the record because it took the president 14 days before he called the attack in Benghazi an act of terror.”

    Yes, WillardRat, you’re a lying sack of shit. Thanks Ms. Crowley, for confirming that for us.

    • “And the suggestion that anybody in my team, whether the Secretary of State, our U.N. Ambassador, anybody on my team would play politics or mislead when we’ve lost four of our own, governor, is offensive. That’s not what we do. That’s not what I do as president, that’s not what I do as Commander in Chief.”
      Excellent answer Mr. President.

    • Mitt insisted that he was correct even after Crowley corrected him. Romney would be a terrible leader. He is going to fall flat on his face in the next debate.

      • I agree. It’s supposedly about foreign policy and I think Mitt has boxed himself into a corner on Libya, so that issue is probably off the table. And even that is a contrived Fox talking point.

    • The bigger gaffe by Romney was why he focused solely on the word “terror” as opposed to questioning why there wasn’t enough security at a consulate in Libya.

  5. Romney has repeatedly said “Government does not create jobs, government does not create jobs” … but then matter-of-factly states, “I am going to create 12 million new jobs as president.”

    How do Democrats, and especially Obama in these debates, not call him out on that bullshit?

    • His main assumption is, that be removing all regulation and restrictions on ‘free enterprise’, that magically, millions of people will be employed as employers can do whatever the fuck they want, to whomever and whatever they feel like.

  6. I hear that Rmoney finally gave us his tax plan:

    Was that the bit he prefaced with the words: “Let’s pick a number…say….”?

    I thought Obama’s answer was very effective – taking the argument away from the sums which is a snooz for average Americans and playing it on Mitt’s ground: “As a successful businessman, if someone said he spend $5tr and then not tell you until after he got the job how he was going raise the $5tr to pay for it …. would you hire him?” Or similar. Very good.

  7. Why is Jackie Gingrich wounding hysterical while lying in her thick Southern accent on my computer screen?

    Good god, imagine listening to that everyday.

  8. In other news, Darryl Hannah is hotter than ever – just saying

    “What is evident is that the Keystone XL pipeline is a private profit venture, not a “public use” project that serves the US national interest.”

    – Smokin’!

    Seriously that is as good an exposure of the Keystone XL pipeline. Only thing she misses is that not just Transcanada benefits – she should name (*cough* Koch!) names. Name the Kochsuckers Darryl, let’s get the light shining on all of thsoe Kochroaches.

  9. Keystone XL Pipeline.

    The GOP likes to say it killed tens of thousands of jobs. The reality:

    “A key question for the administration is how many jobs the Keystone XL project would create. TransCanada’s initial estimate of 20,000 — which it said includes 13,000 direct construction jobs and 7,000 jobs among supply manufacturers — has been widely quoted by lawmakers and presidential candidates.

    Girling said Friday that the 13,000 figure was “one person, one year,” meaning that if the construction jobs lasted two years, the number of people employed in each of the two years would be 6,500. That brings the company’s number closer to the State Department’s; State says the project would create 5,000 to 6,000 construction jobs, a figure that was calculated by its contractor Cardno Entrix.

    As for the 7,000 indirect supply chain jobs, the $1.9 billion already spent by TransCanada would reduce the number of jobs that would be created in the future. The Brixton Group, a firm working with opponents of the project, has argued that many of the indirect supply jobs would be outside the United States because about $1.7 billion worth of steel will be purchased from a Russian-owned mill in Canada.” [The Washington Post, 11/5/11]

    • Did Obama get to point out how much the nation’s oil imports have dropped in his term? That (a complex situation but in no small part caused by upping the mileage requirements on cars)is a direct and major acheivement of his admin.

      Did Mitt talk about how the price is twice as high now as in Jan 2009? If he did I hope Obama bitch-slapped him for his complete lack of understanding of how oil pricing works (“Maybe you should have more $50,000 lunches with your friends the Kochs, Mitt? They’ll clue you in real fast”)

    • Before the “binders” comment, the entire rambling speech about how he wanted to fill out his cabinet reminded me of James Watt; the infamous Interior Secretary under Reagan. Watt was bragging about the diversity on his board:

      James G. Watt – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

      “I have a black, a woman, two Jews and a cripple. And we have talent.”

      Romney was really in the same ballpark. And then the whole thing about making sure the women could go home early to feed the kids; really he lives in the 1950’s.

      • OMFG, I knew he was awful, but wow! Just making that statement shows that he’s surprised that any talent came out of that crowd.

        So, is the talent a separate entity from the black, woman, Jews, and cripple, or is it distributed throughout?

    • What I didn’t notice last night was how skillful President Obama was in disrupting Romney’s speech. When Romney would go off on his talking points, Obama would stand up and move to the front which then caused a distraction for Romney. A commander-in-chief cannot be distracted when dealing with a crisis. Romney has no substance. He only has memorized talking points which means that he is hiding the truth. Romney cannot think on his feet.

      Excellent job, President Obama. I trust you, not Romney to do the right thing.

  10. Rudepundit liked it

    We’ll see in the next few days how this changes anything – I opine that it will stop the rot and swing back a small way to Obama *but* the key was that Rmoney didn’t come over as badly as Obama did two weeks’ ago. Rmoney has to fail for the numbers to move now – and I don’t see him doing that – unless we have another 47% tape still to come.

      • Is it really though? The American public is jingoistic to the point of xenophoia in wide swaths – Rmoney can play the fear card almost anywhere. You can’t reduce FP to a sound bite like Rmoney is going to.

        Can we have Fareed Zakaria moderate? Christiane Amanpour? They aren’t toadies for the Man

    • I loved how Rude pointed out how Romney directing people to go find non-male candidates for his cabinet, was actually affirmative action.

  11. Michael Brodkorb is a sleaze ball who has rarely been accused of telling the truth but this one just might be the exception. He asserts that the Minnesota GOP insisted on placing a “marriage amendment” on the ballot to ensure a big turnout of GOoPers who might grow complacent after they took control of the state’s house and senate. Considering their complete inability to articulate a reasonable excuse for trampling on the rights of homosexuals who want to marry? It makes more sense than anything else I’ve heard.

    http://www.twincities.com/allheadlines/ci_21785537/gay-marriage-ousted-gop-insider-brodkorb-say-amendment

    • These amendments are typically more for voter turnout than anything. Republicans aren’t actually interested in solving these issues. They need the issues too much to rally the base.

  12. QOTD:

    “I think there was a winner in the sense that Barack Obama not only gained ground he lost but he cauterized some wounds that he inflicted on himself by seeming too diffident and disengaged. Both candidates tonight I think tip-toed right up to the point of rudeness, but stepped back. It was a very good fight. I have seen every presidential debate in American history since the floor of Nixon and Kennedy in 1960. This was immeasurably the best,” – George F. Will.

    • MR. ROMNEY: Great. Thank you. And I appreciate that question. I – I just want to make sure that – I think I was supposed to get that last answer, but I want to point out that I don’t believe —
      PRESIDENT OBAMA: I don’t think so, Candy.

      MR. ROMNEY: I don’t believe —

      PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, I want to make sure our timekeepers are working here.

      MS. CROWLEY: OK. The timekeepers are all working.

      That shows exactly how out of touch Mitt is. He didn’t seem to understand this was not the moment for pissing and moaning, it was the time to look in that woman’s face and do his best.

      And the President capitalized on Mitt’s fuck up there, but helping to make it worse — for Mitt.

      • And what’s funny, is in their little “Bias Alert” (Pot, Kettle, Black, for Fox) section they’re complaining that Candy sided with the president.

        The bottom line if Romney hadn’t been such a dick (“Did you say it? Huh? Did you say it? Did you say it? Did you say it?”) then all of this could have been avoided. But the fact of the matter is Romney is a dick, and there it is. Candy was being gracious by giving Romney any acknowledgement of any level of correctness.

  13. I truly fail to understand why it matters what you call what happened in Libya. Other than murder, tragic, etc.

    You investigate, and you bring to justice those who did it.

    Exactly what the president said he is doing (and I have no reason to doubt it).

    • But if it’s not a lie, what good is it?

      What bothers me about these silly-assed “debates” is that the “winner” isn’t necessarily the guy who speaks the truth the most but rather is whichever one, by whichever means, gets the furthest under the other guy’s skin. Truth? Hey, who fucking cares about “truth”! Gimme blood!

      I’m not having much fun these days, watching the US fall off the edge in just about every imaginable way. Never have cared much for deathbed watches, and that’s the truth.

      • frugal, it isn’t any worse at this point in history than it was for our ancestors at other points in history. You might have had a relative that fretted over the downfall of the country when his horse breeding business failed due to that newfangled horseless carriage back when!

  14. Knock, knock, knock.

    Calm barking dog, and answer door.

    Two nice ladies are looking for Nick and Marcy. I tell them they don’t live here anymore.

    They say that’s too bad because they’d had a nice discussion together about the bible.

    I say that’s probably why they moved away.

    Close door.

    Smile.

  15. Chris Hayes on last night’s lack of debate on climate change:

    “Having an energy conversation without talking about climate is like talking about smoking and not talking about cancer.”

  16. A great letter referencing the video and speaking to Obama’s character:

    “I keep coming back to a moment I think was the most important of the debate, and in some ways, Obama’s whole presidency. When he called Romney’s accusations of politicizing Libya “offensive,” I pumped my fist in the air, thrilled. Then, when I found myself going back to that moment again and again, I wondered why it was so powerful.

    Yes, the language was probably planned and practiced, yes it was partly political theater, but it reinforced something about this leader that I think many of us feel, even if we’re not always aware of it. For all the complaints we have about Obama, especially in the conduct of domestic policy, one thing he demonstrates to me, and it’s the reason I revere him more than Bill Clinton, is that he makes careful, patient, principled — and practical — decisions, waits patiently for them to bear fruit, and when they do, he trusts the public to analyze and understand what he’s accomplished on their own. Libya, tellingly, happens to be high on the list.

    There was no crowing about the delicately coordinated bombing campaign (and the covert actions on the ground which helped it succeed) that brought down a tyrant. No “Mission Accomplished” banners, no bold predictions about the future of a remade Middle East thanks to our military efforts. But Obama got results. For less than a thousandth of the cost of Iraq, and with no lives lost until September 11th, Obama gave us a democratically elected Arab ally, an ally whose people — not their leaders, their people — are so grateful for what America did and how we did it, that after the death of our Ambassador they poured into the streets in outrage, and attacked the Islamic militias responsible.

    No the story’s not over. But name another Arab country where you’ve seen anything remotely similar. What political hay does Obama make out of all this? Very little. Then or since. (To my great frustration, frankly.) After the ambassador dies, Obama’s language is full of firmness, but also restraint and moderation, and zero politics. Mitt Romney’s language? The opposite. Obama trusts us to use our eyes and give credit where it’s due.

    His anger in that moment, theatrical or not, was about something deeper. At least it was for me. There must be something horribly galling to our president about being called out for an absurdly minor offense (if it even was one) in the context of a huge foreign policy triumph. It should be galling to us too. We fail to appreciate this president’s exceptional character at our own peril.”

    • It’s rare for the word “humble” to apply to a politician but President Obama is far and away the most humble president since Jimmy Carter; who might have been the most humble president in our history. President Obama is all the more remarkable because he’s so capable and smart enough to realize that fact. Let the Reichwhiners whine about his alleged arrogance. It simply doesn’t match the facts.

    • One of 40,000 uninsured Americans dying becasue they can’t afford their own care…. and the Ignoranti chant: “We’re #1! We’re 1!….”

  17. I just watched the whole thing. Obama did well. Did anyone notice that Romney speaks in that same quick, slightly breathless manner that GWB did whenever he was way out of his depth? (which was most of the time yesterday)

    Just don’t have him as President. The whole Antlantic Ocean won’t put enough of a distance between us and the US for me to feel comfy.

  18. So folks (pundits mostly) were saying Romney looked more “presidential.” By that I assume they meant “Romney is white, and Obama is black, and since all other presidents had been white, Romney looks more presidential.”

    • That’s right, Obama looked like …. the bellhop… /pillow case off

      Shorter GOP Platform: A White Man for every White House

  19. Listening in on a phone conference with Obama supporters — Obama is speaking now! I made a $4 donation, and they sent me an email inviting me to listen in.

    Cool. :)

    • That is one stupid man. If he hadn’t inherited money, he’d be manning the register at McDonalds — and getting fired AGAIN because of his mouth.

  20. Okay a dead thread, my mileau, my waterloooo, my place in this world, thank you for validating that fact, youcommietennisshoewhearingvolvodrivingbirkenstockvegetarianbuddistnonatheistdelusionalpieceoftheman…pfft…

  21. Morning All! How come the Zoo is always busy when I sleep? What did Tagg say? Wanted to slap Obama, cause that’s what you do with the colored help if they get uppity. Nice family that. Can’t they go back to planet Kolon or whatever they call it?

    • The earth would be much improved if the Mittens family left for the great beyond.
      Willard knows the lies he spews and just doesn’t give a damn who it may harm.
      His spawn are spoiled brats.

      • But he’s got five of them. And they procreate! With some assistance, however, wonder why that is. Maybe God had different plans.

        • Curious they didn’t adopt. Their teachings/vomiting point is women shouldn’t/don’t need to have abortions as they can give up the baby for adoption.
          I detest and despise the *holier than thou* crowd.

          • I have no idea what is making people like them tick. I just feel really uncomfortable with their concepts.

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