CNN California Democratic Debate live-blogging..

Tonight on CNN at 5PM Pacific Time.

Well, here we are again, and finally down to two choices…

Next Tuesday is the BIG one.. The super-duper SUPER TUESDAY primary event!

Super Tuesday (2008), Super Duper Tuesday, Giga Tuesday, Tsunami Tuesday, and The Tuesday of Destiny are names for February 5, 2008, the day on which the largest-ever simultaneous number of state U.S. presidential primary elections will be held. Twenty-four states (including American Samoa) are scheduled to hold either caucuses or primary elections for one or both parties on this date.

Its all on the line (supposedly). The problem with that, is the best candidates for the job are no longer in the race. I wonder how people feel about being denied the opportunity to vote for their candidate of choice. I am frankly feeling totally cheated. We have had these final two candidates shoved down our throats my the MSM for a year now. No surprises.. I guess this was inevitable.

(By the way, this debate is sponsored by the Coal industry. Don’t expect much discussion about fighting global warming or cleaning up the air..)

Tonight’s debate will be moderated by Wolf Blitzer. If this debate is anything like the GOP debate last night, expect to see sparks and drama from the very first question. Every question put to the candidates will likely be framed in order to maximize to draw out the most contention, drama, and anything controversial or inflammatory that has been in the headlines for weeks for the full dramatic effect. Likely the first question will be to Obama: “Umm, Senator Obama, why was it that you snubbed Hillary Clinton last Monday night at the “State of the Union” address by not shaking her hand and saying hello, instead turning away to talk to Sen. McCaskill?” (Just you watch..)

In case you missed it.. Last night, one of the few questions to Mike Huckabee was something to the effect of: “Rush Limbaugh says that if you win the nomination you will destroy the Republican Party. Do you agree?”. Now, I don’t care for Huckabee either, but is that honestly debating the issues, or giving the candidate a fair shot??

DON’T expect to see substance or direct, clear, in-depth answers to issues that people wish to hear about in order to learn exactly what either of these candidates would actually DO. (At least we won’t have to see John Edwards sitting there being totally ignored while the other two duke it out..)

DO expect to see another undignified mud-fest, with arrows of accusation, misrepresentation, and insinuation being shot back and forth. CNN appears to be far more interested in the ratings.. They will make sure all the questions will be framed in a way that will benefit one of the candidates over the other. A spectator sport.. I frankly think they should just give them paint balls, squirt guns, boxing gloves, or a mud pit, and let them just have at it. At least it would make it a little more entertaining.. 😉

I am curious which candidate the questions will favor tonight? Who will the MSM crown the winner? I am sure they have already determined who they will be putting in the best light to give the greatest advantage..

These debates are squandering a good opportunity for Americans to learn what they need to know in order to make a clear, educated choice for the most important decision they will be making in 2008. This country is in serious trouble. It is time to get real.

221 thoughts on “CNN California Democratic Debate live-blogging..

  1. With the choices offered by the two major parties, this may be the first time that an Independent could carry a national election.

  2. Will be missing the debate.

    The premiere of “Lost” is on @ 8:00pm (est)
    I’m much more excited about that than casting my vote this upcoming Tuesday.

  3. Body language! They loathe each other. is voting online.

    There are no rules. Opening statements Obama begins and starts with John Edwards.

  4. No rules tonight.

    Opening statements 90 seconds.

    Obama first. He’s acknowledging Edwards. (He wants his endorsement..)
    He says one of the two will be president. Says he was friends with Hillary before the campaign, and will be friends with Hillary after the campaign is over.

  5. Hillary:

    stack of problems waiting. Economy, health care, global warming…start on day one…poverty.

    Problem solver needed, she’s the one.

  6. I had to put dinner on the table and missed the opening statement. What’s with these people they want to eat all the time.

  7. Policy distinction between the two

    Hillary, health care a must, mortgage crisis, moratorium on foreclosures for 90 days…Oh no! The guys plotting against us! Hey that’s Giulianis turf and he is out.

  8. First question was to Hillary. What are the differences between she and Barack?

    She is saying the differences between the two of them are nothing compared to the differences between them and the Republicans.

    She is pulling something up that Barack said at the first debate.

    She is the first to use the change word tonight. Trying to take that one away from him..

  9. This is completely lame. I don’t want either of these people.

    Does anybody know of a nice country I can move to that has a climate comparable to California?

    These two candidates are still here because they promised their masters that they wouldn’t get the troops out of Iraq before 2013. They also din’t say that they would get them out after 2013. Notice that? Did ya? Did you notice that that is how they worded it.

    Neither of these freaks plans on bringing troops home and stopping the senseless blood shed.

  10. The thing that Obama said at that first debate was that in the first year of his presidency , he would meet with leaders of countries like Iran and N. Korea. She said you would never do that.

  11. Obama, health insurance, reason people don’t have healthcare, they can’t afford it. Make it affordable.

    Mortgage crisis 10 billion forclosure prevention fund not to help the banks, but to help keep people in their homes.

    Reduce the influence of lobbyists and special interests.

    Iraq, I was against the war from the start. Emphasis on diplomacy, talk even to the bad guys.

  12. Healthcare:

    Q: Under BO plan, 15 million people would still not be covered. Why is his plan superior to Hillary’s?

    A: He doesn’t believe there will be that many uncovered. All children would be covered. There would be some who don’t want to be covered. There will be some who can’t afford it but need to be subsidized.

  13. HC: We’ll make it affordable and quality for everyone. They would provide subsidies and cap premiums. Cover children till they are 25.
    “Shared responsibility”.

  14. More on health care. The passionate cause of her entire career. “My husband’s administration” comes up. No single payer system from her, lot’s of unworkable hot air.

    Bringin up John Edwards again…sounds like the democratic version of Ronald Reagan

  15. Obama wants to lower premiums. He can bring both parties together. Make Americans understand what it will take.
    Increase transparency to offset the drug adn insurance companies (special interests).

  16. Obama wants to lower premiums. He can bring both parties together. Make Americans understand what it will take.
    Increase transparency to offset the drug adn insurance companies (special interests).
    He wants to do this on C-Span. ?

  17. Transparency, we will broadcast on c-span negotiations about health care – good one. Transparency after the kings of secrecy would be nice.

  18. HC: Insurance companies have to cover everyone. Cannot reject care or coverage. By regulating.

    Let Medicare negotiate with drug companies to get the prices down.

  19. We are a bit stormy here and the lights are flickering. If I disappear it is because we lose power.

    That said..

    Asked about how they counter Liberal Tax&Spend dems.

    BO: Too many details for my brain.. EV, hope you are getting this. He got in a zinger at McCain. Says Republicans talk tax cuts, but have been the ones to drive up the debt which basically taxes all of us.
    He would cut the tax breaks to the top of the wealthy.

  20. It looks like they are playing nice so far.. It is definitely different than last night. Digs are subtle.

    Hillary is reminding everyone how well people did when Bill was pres.

  21. How would you address unemployment, low wages for African-Americans due to immigrant labor?

    BO: We have to get control of the borders. Crack down on employers who take advantage of the situation.
    Have to get a pathway to citizenship after they pay a fine.
    We have had an economy out of balance, tax benefits that have been going up instead of down..

  22. Tough one. Immigration and unemployment. Crack down on employers and make sure the law is heeded. BaO is pretty good here. Economy is more the problem than immigration.

    muse, you mean the straight talk express without wheels?

  23. HC: She agrees there have been job losses due to above question.
    Bring our country together to bring about comprehensive immigration reform.
    Tighten borders, crack down on empl., help communities cope with costs.

    Come out of the shadows, we will give you path to citizenship if you follow steps – pay a fine, learn english, etc.. then we will talk drivers license, etc..

    I probably missed a lot of that..

  24. Is it me, I know I’m a little challenged on the language side, but I mostly don’t get what HC ist talking about. She preconceives that we should know in depth how politics are working and she only knows if we don’t understand. And if she says realistic again, I’m gonna puke. Realistic and practical, here it is again.

  25. Its still on immigration. She is talking about how inhumane Congress has been about this so far.
    Now Wolf is pressuring her for her stance on giving illegal immigrants drivers licenses. I remember now. From the first debate and the so called flipflopping of her stance. He is zeroing in on her answer again.

  26. Q: BO:

    A lot of Americans agree that HC is more prepared to be President from day one. Do you agree?
    (Hate these questions.. Insinuates that they are correct and plants the ideas in peoples’ minds)

    He says “a lot of Americans DON’T agree”. Zing.
    Now he is going into detail while he IS prepared.

  27. to HC:

    Shit.. Here we go again.. Her 35 years of experience.
    I guess that means with 25 years of experience being married to a doctor I can now start taking call for him, maybe even apply to the medical staff at the hospital..

    I want to know how she can claim 35 years experience to be president and NOBODY calls her on it!!

  28. Question to both:
    If running mate Romney
    Why should voters make you chief executive officer of the country. She is talking now about Bush adn “look what we got!”


    Romney hasn’t gotten such a great return on his investment thus far..

  29. Q: on the endorsement of the Kennedy’s.
    How do you respond to comparison to JFK?

    She says she has the support of other Kennedy’s. Says it is a huge thing to be the first woman president. She is bringing up the change word again.
    She is changing the subject.

  30. change change change woman president gender change .

    HC: Neither of us would have predicted we would be sitting here not very long ago. What happened to inevitability

  31. He is making the distinction of “new generation” versus old generation.

    He is saying we shouldn’t settle. We should be looking forward and moving forward with change.

    Who can inspire. Who can press the levers of change.

  32. Read through the comments here and saw maybe 30 seconds of the debate. EV and Muse, I have to thank you for reinforcing my decision to read a book instead 🙂

    BTW – OT, please forgive, but I highly recommend Keith’s Special Comment from tonight.

  33. Another break. It takes a Clinton to clean up after a Bush. Well, who’ll clean up after her? I still haven’t heard a word from her I could believe. I feel they are plaing easy balls into her side. Obama doesn’t get his share of words in.

  34. In case nobody has any encouraging words to offer, I hope you all will keep up the good work. I don’t have cable so this live-blogging is really helpful.

  35. Back.

    Talking now about withdrawal in Iraq.

    To HC: Why are you so unclear? Will it be an open-ended commitment?

    She is still talking around it. She is talking about what she would talk to her military advisors about. She is talking about the over 100,000 civilians who be still be in Iraq if we removed troops too soon. Saying Iraq has to take responsibility.
    She is saying how irresponsible Bush is to leave this mess to the next president.

    She didn’t make a commitment. She hopes but won’t commit.

  36. BO:

    We have to be as careful getting out as we were careless getting in. He brings up what McCain said about being there 100 years..

    He is talking about other countries as well, that undermine this country’s security.

    He says we need to set a date. Iraqi’s need to know we are serious.

  37. Iraq:

    careful does it says she. As many as possible as soon as possible.

    BaO: End this war, no permanent occupation. Problem is Afghanistan, Pakistan. Iraq is undermining security. Wants to set a date to show he’s serious.End the mindset that got US in the war in the first place.

  38. BO says we need to clarify the mission. He says it was a mistake in the first place.
    He says he will be the best Dem to go up against the GOP because he says he has been clear about his stance since the beginning.

    To HC:
    So Hillary is now name dropping again. (Maxine Waters).
    We need to send a message to Iraq that we are serious.
    She is pointing out what will happen to surrounding countries, neighbors to Iraq when we pull out. Talks about the need to get all players to the table.

  39. Now the lying gets too much. She “misunderstood” what the authority was all about, and Bush abused it, oh my…

    She voted for the war, because she wanted to be president one day and wanted to look tough. That cost almost 4’000 lives of your troops.


  40. BO:

    Talking stats on the intolerance of the war and loss of lives. Says basically that we need a nominee who can stand and say it was always a BAD idea and was never for it. That it was a flawed decision from the start.

    Says what he would do instead. He is making a great point about wh he would be the better candidate for that reason.

    Wolf is trying to get Hillary to say that what she did was a mistake.

    She won’t do it. Unfortunate. She shares that quality with Bush.

  41. BaO said it like it is. He was against the war and this gives him more credibility.

    Now the she-candidate is using many words again to not say she made a mistake. And she’s lying through her teeth. It was not possible to see that Bush was obsessed with going into Iraq? Had she read a couple of European newspapers she’d have known. Or listened to what the anti war crowd said.

    Goood one, Wolf. Was she naive? No she wasn’t she knew what she was doing.

  42. She is putting it all on Bush now.
    She’d get a lot of yardage if she would just acknowledge she made a mistake.
    She is talking now about all the problems we have to untangle.
    She is trying to say she just has to be strong going up against the Republicans. She wants to focus NOW on going forward, not looking back. Brother, she has been bragging about her 35 years experience, and her husband’s presidency.. That is looking backward.. But..

    Wolf just tried to make the point she was saying she had just been naiive. Crowd is booing.

  43. Go for meat Barack!!

    The title of the resolution was “use militrary force” how can she say she didn’t vote for war, just for inspectors?

    And he wants to go to the WH and use his better judgement from day one. Hah!

    She did not look good here, They are openin the debate to baser discussions presently when they’ll talk about character.

    In case you didn’t realize I’m biased as hell. I wish they’d ask her about the Floridian delegates.

  44. I think Hillary is making a mistake in buying into the old idea of the people not forgiving a woman for making a mistake. In any other circumstance she may have been right, but not now. Now is the time for truth.

  45. Really ev.

    They’re back.

    Q: BO:

    Too much sex and violence coming out of Hollywood? What would you do about it?

    Primary responsibility is to the parents. He is not for censorship. Give parents the tools. Internet is the problem too. Develop technology to empower parents. (Directors adn producers in the audience).

    Talking to them saying give some thought to who they are marketing too..

  46. HC:
    Spouse question..
    Bill has set off firestorms.. If you can’t control your husband now, what will it be like when you are in the WH?
    She bursts out in that horrible loud cackle.
    Answering its her presidency. She is the one running for office. Her name is on the ballot. Her responsibility as commander in chief.

  47. BO is talking about who he would want as cabinet member or running partner – in general.
    No more yes men in the WH. Competent people.. He wants them to understand they are working FOR the American people.
    Wolf is trying to pin him down on Clinton.


    She is agreeing with everything BO just said. Basically, noncommital.

  48. Back…

    Sex and violence in Hollywood. As a parent BaO is concerned, rejects censorship. Give parents tools to monitor. And the industry should look what they play to what audience.

    Spouses: Bill set off firestorms. What will Bill do in the WH, who controls what he does. Cackles (burrr) I am running for President, not Bill.

    Last questions. Dream ticket Obama/Clinton Clinton/Obama. She cackles again. BaO wants integer people independent people wants to carry the people’s voices into the WH.

    HC wants a united Democratic Party and get out the timetable for her next campaign stop. Marketing herself instead of the office she’s running for.

    Well, it’s done and we’ll see on Tuesday how it comes out.

    Barack is shaking hands Clinton talks to Blitzer.

    We have 4 a.m. here and I may be excused for retiring. I’ll bring you what the European media said some time tomorrow.

  49. Well, time for me to take a break and go make dinner. I’ll be back in a bit. Carry on..

    I’ll listen to the pundits if I can stand it and report back later if they say anything worth repeating.

  50. Great job, guys. Discounting some understandable bias, and just from the comments on this blog, it looks to me like BaO came out on top.

  51. I’ll be voting on Super Tuesday, assuming I can get to the polls — snow forecast for the next 10 days.

    If I have to choose between these two, it will definitely be Barack Obama.

  52. Zoo,
    You can cure your headache tonight with a half liter of scotch since you have no educational obligations tomorrow. Small problem, when you wake up, you’ll wish you had never been born.

  53. Zoo, you’ll vote for Obama? Who would you have voted for if they were still in it (out of the original group)? If they were still on the ballot, then you should vote for them yes? In other words, Obama is a tactical vote – the corporations depend on you holding your nose and voting the least worst candidate…

  54. TtT,

    I’m in Idaho, so really any vote I make for someone left of Attila the Hun is worthless. But if everyone were still in the running, I would have written in Kucinich.

  55. Evening all, took a nap and then caught the debate..The warm and fuzzy was a dead heat to me..If I took a justice scale and put coin’s on each side evenly to account for their backer’s then added the answer’s from each by the time it was over there was very little diffrence…Maybe it realy doesn’t matter at this point who win’s as long as one of them doe’s, but, I still would of liked to hear any one of the other’s that were cut thrown in there…I believe we are being short changed and getting the marshmellow’s instead of a sward which is what we realy need…Just my thought’s…Blessings

  56. Hi everyone.

    “Lost” is over. Probably was a lot more interesting than the debate.

    We really need a hero(heroine) to come in, in a third party, to save our country. We will not be helped by any of the candidates we currently have available.

  57. I agree with what you’re saying True. I have to say I am really discouraged. Last night was absolutely disgusting. Tonight was more polite, but I didn’t learn anything and they were going through the motions.

  58. If Gore stepped up tot he plate, he would take over the energy of the country right away. He won’t do it because its too late as a Dem, and I don’t see him ever becoming an Independent.
    I am curious what will happen with Bloomberg. I don’t know anything about him other than he is filthy rich.

  59. Why not start a new party? An Inconvenient party?

    I admit I don’t know much about the Green Party, but why not run under their banner?
    Gore would certainly give millions of people hope.

  60. Bloomberg has quietly assembled and paid for private polling in all fifty states. I heard that a few days ago. He has been consulting all kinds of people. Why would he put out that kind of money if he wasn’t thinking about it? Rumor is he would have Chuck Hagel as a running mate.

  61. Yah he would Trueblue but I think he is to good for this mess at this point and the two we saw tonight are not good enough..By to good I mean he is doing more good where he is and is accomplishing the dream he has alway’s wanted to do…..Any one of the other candidate’s we had to begin with I think would be better as president….Blessings

  62. Bloomberg is exploring, but I think it’s too late for an Independent run. He can probably write off his expenses on his taxes. The rich get all the perks, right? I have never been able to write off my mortgage interest — didn’t make enough. How fair is that?

    Anyhoo, if a Bloomberg run happens, I’ll be shocked and amazed.

    Sorry to be such a downer.

  63. Weeelll Zoo, if it was me, I’d write in whosoever I thought was worth voting for, no matter what at this point. – holding your nose and voting for the least obnoxious just validates the system. Only vote I’m casting is filled with gasoline and has a rag sticking out of the top.

  64. TtT,

    If there’s any chance this state is so disgusted with the King, and might go back to being a Dem state, I’m gonna run with it. Sorry.

    Otherwise, I’ll bring an extra lighter….

  65. The only big concern I have about McCain is that I saw my father-in-law succumb to the ravages of Alzheimer’s. Every time he went to the doctor’s, he would rally to the cause. Five minutes later, he would develop a blank stare and take the ride home. McCain rallies now and then, but exhibits moments of downright indifference at other times.

  66. Walt, I think McCain is just a plain mean, nasty person. His temper is legendary. Perhaps from a head injury..? I think he can be charming under the right circumstances, but he can be very nasty. Not the right temperament for the leader of a country. Old and crotchety? No thank you. Having a psycho in charge the last 7 years has been a nightmare. Time to heal, not make things worse.

  67. Walt, the “100 years”, the “surge worked”, “Baghdad is so safe I only need a Marine company and one Apache to by a rug” – you’re cool with that?

    Ah, but then Ronald Raygun – forgot about him.

  68. Dunno Muse, “time to heal” might be better served with “they are on the ground, so kick em in the nuts and step on their face”. They’d do the same to you, you know it now.

  69. Thank you for the complient True, in realety I am nothing more than a spotter, witch, old crone…I’m the one person in the forest that can spot a blink of a bird, twitch of the deer’s ear, the twig that is realy antler’s…I can find a tiny snow flake spot in a murial and realize it is a dust spot to be fixed….A word or move in body language that indicate’s the person’s true meaning or what they are trying to hide…Year’s of fixing mistake’s and observation is all….Just practice…..I have practised with the camera and paint brush of life that’s all…Every one here is on the same path, I’m just a little further down the road…..LOL…Hope to meet ya all on this road again tomorrow….Blessings back at ya.

  70. In a nutshell, dbadass.

    Hil was banking on her (Bill’s) experience.

    Barack was banking on his good judgment.

    The university is closed tomorrow.

    I’ve had just a teensy more than two glasses of wine.

    Not sure about anyone else. 🙂

  71. I just opened a beer if that counts. I find it ill advised to drink while wielding sharp instruments and slippery fishes. Do you know the Boogle Vineyard. I love that stuff. Who’d they call it for?

  72. Do you know the Boogle Vineyard. I love that stuff. Who’d they call it for?

    Mr. Boogle?
    What is the Boogle Vineyard, and why do you love it?

  73. I had a friend (actually still do) who drank a dozen ‘Miller lites’ in a Plastic Paddy pub in San Antonio thinking they were low-cal. I won $10 off her husband betting against her making it the bathroom without falling over.

  74. I’m usually just a beer girl.
    Although when I visit my friend in Boston, It’s Bacardi Limon With Cran-Raspberry.

    Then it’s party time.

  75. I’ll marry Minnie – -love her accent.

    Fuck Kelly and get rid of her — she’s older than me and has seriously had work done.

    Kill Monica — she’s caused enough trouble.

  76. Birthdays today. Same with the boys.
    Didn’t I make a ruling relative to mixed triads.
    Since Nancy is a girls she gets fucked, Glenn definately gets killed, and Louie handles the household finances

  77. So, Kurt Vonnegut’s chocolate starfish….. LOL . I miss that guy, are there any left who can point out just how fucked up it all is…. Jonathan Swift, Sam Clemens, Kurt Vonnegut…. where are you now?

  78. db since 1993. Washed up on the North American continent nearly 20 years ago, found the entire place totally devoid of anything worth drinking. Brewing was a necessary survival technique – I’d have topped myself years ago without it.

    I’ve pissed better beer than most of what I found here in 1989. Life is better now. Those heroes at New Belgium are irreplaceable.

  79. Terry! I have no place to brew anymore and have lost the motivation, but I used to be pretty serious about it. Wrote for most of the brewing magazines and was even on the Board of Advisors of the AHA. Now I rely on all the good professionals around — and I live about 10 blocks from Belmont Station, which has 1,000 beers to choose from.

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