The Watering Hole – February 19- Evolution

Creationists have used the argument that Real time evolution has never been demonstrated. In fact, I watched an online video that rebuked the creationists.

Now, we have a recent event that should put the creationists into the dustbin of history. The common Atlantic tomcod has shown a resistance to PCB’s in the Hudson River that is isolated to individuals who inhabit that water system. No where else in the world is that trait observed.

What is even more dramatic is that the release of PCB’s into that water system has been isolated to the last 64 years. PCB’s were not released into that watershed nor any other watershed before then. No other populations of that species exhibit that resistance.

For the full story, look here.

This is our Open Thread. Please feel free to present your thoughts on any topic that comes to mind.

139 thoughts on “The Watering Hole – February 19- Evolution

  1. Morning all. CheeseFlap, a great way to start the day. Haiku goes well with coffee.

    I’m off in a bit for Madison. Looks like the weather will be good and I hope to take lots of pictures.

  2. CheeseFlap, thanks for honoring TheZoo with another of your fabulous haikus.

    Hooda, let us know if the governor sends in camel- and horse-riders with whips to beat the protesters. And take pictures of any tear gas canisters you see that have “Made in the USA” stamped on them. πŸ™‚

  3. Look for my friend Steve. One of the best brewers I’ve known. He came to a conference here in Portland in the late 80s and brought two entire cases of Wisconsin bocks to share.

  4. Walt, Wisconsin holds at least one of the last small INDEPENDENT regional breweries, and had a number of them into the 90s that had been around through the 20th Century. And Milwaukee? Home to some of the biggest breweries of their time: Miller, Pabst, Blatz, Schlitz and smaller breweries scattered around the state: Huber, Leinenkugel, Point. When the craft breweries start to bloom in the PNW, Wisconsin was another early center, turning out great beer with an emphasis on lagers (natural to the region), like Lakefront, Sprecher, and Capital.

    Lots of German and Polish settled in the state and they do love their beer.

  5. Steamed fish is great. The Chinese got me started on that one and it works well.
    Never tried boiling it.
    I get shrimp FOB (fresh off boat) 100 lbs at a time and we have some deeeeeelishus shrimp boils.

      • I’m not sure what I’m looking at on the UStream video, but it appears they have a street blocked off and crowds of people have been streaming across it for quite a while. There are thousands of them!

        • UStream is back to the teabaggers. They aren’t as active. They just stand there, while the anti-Walker protesters walk around in groups and chant slogans. Interestingly, the teabaggers look pissed, while the others look happier. One would think it would be the other way around.

          Some of the kids are infiltrating the teabagger crowd. πŸ˜€

  6. My mother used to cook cod in the pressure cooker. Needless to say, my mother was one of the worst cooks on the planet.

    Steamed fish is an entirely different, er, kettle of fish. As vinylspear says, the Chinese are masters at it, especially whole fish of a delicate flavor. One technique calls for slashing the fish every inch or so and laying in shreds of ginger and scallions. Done properly, it’s not only delicious but makes a beautiful presentation.

  7. My mom cooked everything using Shake-n-Bake. I learned to cook at an early age. We had two days of great outside weather, now cold is returning on the heels of 50mph winds.

    • Outstanding, my mom used a lot of shake-n-bake when it was new, but thank goodness she moved on. πŸ™‚

      I learned to cook in my mid-teens, then my mom went back to work and I became the family cook. My food tastes decent, but it certainly isn’t fancy.

  8. Traditionally Scandinavian steamed or boiled fish in Minnesota is called Lutefisk. It’s herring, if memory serves, soaked in lye for preservation, then ‘refreshed’ in salty water. It’s said that in Minnesota you can always spot a Norwegian house — the back porch will be sagging due to lutefisk causing it to rot. When I was a kid, the Lutefisk arrived at the local small town grocery a couple of weeks before Christmas and the owner, Lloyd Martinson, would set up wooden racks on the sidewalk and lay those big brown fish on the rack, then prop the rack up till nearly ground level, maybe a foot off the ground. My dad explained to me that Norwegians liked Lutefisk better after the dogs had had about a week’s worth of leg lifting on it.

    My sainted mother used to fix that stuff every Christmas eve. Caused me to hate Christmas.

  9. **till nearly ground level, maybe a foot off the ground**

    Right. Make that ’till nearly vertical, maybe a foot off the ground’

    Something about Saturdays’ impact on fingers or keyboard, I’m thinking.

  10. My mom was of Swedish descent, and was born in Wisconsin. It sound like I’m fortunate she used shake-n-bake rather than traditional scandinavian foods.

  11. Speaking of da U.P., this is my Dad, sister and brother (I’m at the bottom of the frame) on the beach of Big Bay de Noc, at Tylene’s Motel, on U.S. 2 near Cooks, MI. The photo is from 1958.

  12. I lived in Norway, west of Big Bay de Noc, near Iron Mountain. I can picture Cooks, if I remember correctly that’s all there was is the motel.

    • I had enough of mosquitos in Gitmo, and little things they called “flying teeth.” Jeebus, for the first few months I looked like I had a perpetual case of measles.

  13. Shayne, my mother came from upper middle class New Jersey Scotch-Irish Presbyterian stock. Her mother was a great cook, but Doris was the baby of the family and simply never learned to cook. It wasn’t until my dad retired that I realized that she was so bad at it simply because she hated to cook. Even brewing a pot of tea is beneath her.

    We survived because my dad was a researcher with Birds Eye and we always had a freezer filled with frozen vegetables (didn’t have fresh broccoli until well into my 20s), and stocks of General Foods items in the cupboard.

    Eventually, I ended up working in a commercial kitchen and not only learned to cook (still obsessed about having everything come out at the same time), I learned to love it and learned to love food.

  14. Avatar: that would be me circa summer of 1947 or 48 in my S. Minn. backyard. The garb, including tomahawk, vest, feathered hat, and tent were most likely part of my effort to become tribal so as to avoid Lutefisk on the next Christmas eve.

  15. Thought y’all might enjoy seeing this since we covered it the other day.

    ‘Tide for Toomer’s’ Raises Money To Save Poisoned Trees

    It could have been an event that further divided two adversaries, pitting them bitterly against each other for all time.

    Instead, the poisoning of the Toomer’s Oaks has joined many fans of long-time rivals Auburn University and the University of Alabama – all in support of saving the 130-plus-year-old landmark trees.

    Thursday night, UA alumna Jennifer Hanson, along with four other supporters, created a Facebook page called β€œTide for Toomer’s.”

    As of press time Friday, the site had raised more than $20,000 toward helping save the trees and garnered nearly 38,000 fans.

    • UPDATE:

      I just heard from Hoodathunk. He’s in the rotunda of the WI capital building, and he said it’s absolutely packed with people. It was hard to hear much, but it sounded pretty festive. I also talked to PamperoFirpa from TP (he and Hoodthunk are together), and he said there are about 50K anti-budget protesters and 2K teabaggers. I told them the media has pretty much dropped the ball over the weekend, and they weren’t surprised — but they will continue!!

      Hooda says he has lots of pictures!

  16. gummitch,
    I thought that Zooey was serving time at Gitmo and was trying to convince everybody that an enjoyable time could be had in Moscow, Idaho. Was it really the other way around?

    • Vinyl, I think I’ve seen it in the store. It’s probably near the Hamburger Helper. My mom was a big fan of that when I was a kid — she really liked the trendy stuff. I saw Tuna Helper the other day, and I don’t know if she ever tried that…thank goodness.

  17. Hamburger helper markets aggressively.
    I haven’t seen a shake n bake commercial in many many years, and that was on a TV with rabbit ears.

  18. Shake n Bake: “It ain’t fried, it burnt! ’cause I hepped!”

    I said that in front of the family after one of those commercials played and my dad almost blew his beer through his nose.

  19. My daughter-in-law would use Tuna Helper with lobster, given the opportunity; ergo, my son cooks and my granddaughter is learning.

  20. I hope that’s it. I haven’t seen her since late Thursday.

    Ladies In Racing Daytona Report

    Danica did pretty well at Daytona, qualifying 4th, with her team owner Dale Earnhardt Jr. next to her in the 3rd spot. One of the two front row cars was a Cup regular Clint Bowyer, who ‘pushed’ her to the lead briefly, but she lost a lap late in the race and finished 14th. Drafting isn’t one of her favorite ways to race, but it’s essential at Daytona. The weird aero rules this year make two cars together faster than one, but also make two cars together faster than three or more, which isn’t normal. Plus, the second car has to gently ‘push’ the front car, while the lack of air to it’s radiator makes its water temperature get too high. Then the two drivers must execute a delicate swap of positions and let the hot car cool down by running in front. While they are swapping position other pairs of cars are passing them, then they get their spot back when the other pairs have to swap. Tomorrow’s Cup race should produce more of the same kind of action. Still, it was her best finish yet in a Nascar race.

  21. Tuna helper with lobster?
    I’m sorry to hear that.
    Wow, just wow…

    I can make a wicked eggs Benedict over a lobster tail with a blue crab, lemon and lime zest hollandaise sauce with crushed green pepper, cayenne and smoked paprika.

    where in the hell is dbadass for this discussion?

    • I have a question about eggs benedict. I’ve never made them before, but every time I have them in a restaurant, I always wonder why they don’t toast the english muffin. It would add a nice texture to the whole thing. Is there a reason why they don’t toast the english muffin?

  22. The muffin should be toasted.
    The way that I toast the muffin is to place it face down in a hot skillet with butter and let it brown. Don’t rush it, be patient
    If you toast it in a toaster it will toast, but it will not have the same flavor as toasting it in a pan and letting the butter and the bread brown together.
    Huge flavor difference.
    if you really want to go over the top, perform the above steps and then add asiago cheese to the face of the muffin and finish it off briefly in a toaster oven to melt the cheese.

  23. Years ago, there was a place in San Francisco on Fisherman’s Wharf — can’t remember the name, but it was a small seafood place — and on their morning menu was what the called Crabs Benedict. Fresh and delicious Hollandaise, English muffins, and fresh crab. Damn, it was good. Went back at every opportunity for several years, whenever I happened to be in S.F.

  24. Zooey,
    Probably because English muffins from the bakery section or even the freezer, are not English muffins, you have to make your own. Today’s restaurant “chefs” are just plain lazy. My mom used to brown them under the broiler with a butter coating before applying the ham, poached egg and Hollandaise sauce (Which she made from scratch.)

    The poached egg was actually poached to boot.

    But then mom was a professional cook (read chef). My arteries testify to that!

  25. Just wanted to let my friends here at The Zoo know, that we had to assist Oliver Twist, the cat in my Avatar, cross the “rainbow bridge” this morning. Needless to say, it’s been a difficult day for me and my husband. Ollie was our favorite cat. He had a lot of personality and that is one of the things that made him so endearing to us. Besides, you could play with his ears because he had no sensation on the tip of his ears due to frostbite. Ollie is now resting within the earth under our favorite crab apple tree. Thanks to everyone for their kindness. A special shout out to Cheeseflap for the Haiku. I have memorized this Haiku. It was especially beautiful and sensitive to what we are feeling. I have found that The Zoo is a place of comfort during difficult times. You critters are the best.

  26. He will be there waiting or you when you cross to the other side.
    It’s a big circle and we all have friends waiting for us.

  27. Another story about my mom. She could not abide with the oleo offered during WWII. She bought a lactating cow, purchased her feed and arranged with a local farmer (at the end of the street) to house her. Mom’s agreement with the farmer was that she would get one milking day per week and he would get whatever was left over. From the cow, we got enough raw milk to feed the gang, we churned the butter at home with enough overage to supply all of the “TheMans” (four other families ) during the week. We also got to milk the cow on “our” days.

    The farmer supported his family and actually built a stand where he sold the extra as well as fresh veggies from his fields during the summer.

  28. One of my favorite Portland breakfast/lunch places does a wicked Eggs Benedict but almost always offer variations like a Dungeness crabcake Benedict or one made with smoked salmon.

    The most common place to fall down on the job is the Hollandaise. If the sauce isn’t killer, which takes time, the rest is all just wasted.

  29. Cats,

    Our condolences on your loss. Jane and I know all too well the pain of losing such a special friend. Our first cat (and still the best), Becca, used to enjoy playing games with us and in addition to being very, very smart, she had a sense of humor, too. She could even be sarcastic in her vocalizations, such as when we would change the litter box way past the time when she felt it should be changed, We’d finish and say, “There ya go, Becca,” and she would respond with a sarcastic Meow as she stepped into it to use it.

  30. Walt, you and my parents are the only people I know that still refer to oleo. I can remember living where stores were prohibited from putting it in the dairy section. The oleo sold in the part of Canada we visited summers went one step further — they were prohibited from coloring the stuff and it was sold with a little packet of food color that could be stirred thoroughly into what looked like a big slab of Crisco.

  31. During WWII, mom would find sailors from the Baltimore area who were coming home and were based in Connecticut. she would give them bus fare up and down with the stipulation that they would go to the Hartford Market, purchase live lobsters on her tab there and bring them down. In return, she arranged for the sailor and a “spouse” to bunk down at my Grandparents house with a lobster dinner and all of the fixings.

    She had a waiting list!

  32. Cats, I’m sorry to hear about your little friend. I think all my cats have had special personalities, as I miss them all.

    • Gary, that is great!

      I love it how the guy tries to clarify that he’s with Fux Business channel — as if it’s any different.

      I’d rather have the guy in the crowd yelling “Fox Lies!” At least he’s honest, and isn’t trying to collapse this country in the name of the almighty dollar.

          • Teh stupid lives at the WI teabagger protest:

            Gregory, of Milwaukee (he declined to give his last name), took a somewhat broader analysis. “I’m for people, not the government,” he said. “I think people should solve their own problems.”

            What does this mean in the context of a dispute over union rights? “I think they should be treated like the private sector,” Gregory explained. “The state is broke. We can’t pay for pensions when the state is broke – the same thing Scott Walker says.”

            Gregory added something about his fundamental beliefs: “I consider the Ten Commandments the definition and the responsibility of liberty,” saying any great leader must take his direction from these. And, in a criticism inspired by Obama’s health care reform bill, he offered a critique of legislation in general: “No law should have more words than the U.S. Constitution.”

            I thanked Gregory and moved on. Later, it occurred to me to look something up. Ah, yes, here we go: According to an online resource, the un-amended U.S. Constitution has 4,543 words, including signatures. According to my computer’s word count of a cut-and-paste file, Senate Bill 11, Walker’s budget repair bill, has 48,966.


  33. Cats, I’m so sorry to hear about Ollie, I know how hard this must have been for you. I wish that I had the words to comfort you, but I’m sending you a big mental hug along with my heartfelt sympathy.

  34. Zooey,

    WTF is wrong with people??? Why are some people so proud to put their absolute ignorance on display? I’m pretty sure if Matt Taibbi was writing that piece, he would have described Gregory as mentally challenged in some way, or as an apparent full-time Fox news Channel viewer.

    • Wayne, what can I say? The ignorant are often supremely confident in their ignorance.

      I’d think it was funny, if it weren’t so pervasive and so close to destroying our democracy.

  35. Gregory added something about his fundamental beliefs: β€œI consider the Ten Commandments the definition and the responsibility of liberty,” saying any great leader must take his direction from these.

    Pfffffft The Ten Commandments.

    Here’s Walt Whitman’s more positive version of commandments and more than ten, and all about what we should do rather than what we shouldn’t:

    “This is what you shall do: Love the earth and sun and the animals, despise riches, give alms to every one that asks, stand up for the stupid and crazy, devote your income and labor to others, hate tyrants, argue not concerning God, have patience and indulgence toward the people, take off your hat to nothing known or unknown or to any man or number of men, go freely with powerful uneducated persons and with the young and with the mothers of families, read these leaves in the open air every season of every year of your life, re-examine all you have been told at school or church or in any book, dismiss whatever insults your own soul; and your very flesh shall be a great poem and have the richest fluency not only in its words but in the silent lines of its lips and face and between the lashes of your eyes and in every motion and joint of your body.”

    I guess that means enduring the idiocy of the teabaggers. Sigh.

  36. I guess that means enduring the idiocy of the teabaggers.

    Just don’t become so tolerant that we tolerate intolerance. (paraphrased from Bill Maher)

  37. What a day. It was like nothing I have ever experienced. So much positive energy and a huge shitpot of people all high fiving, shaking hands, fist bumping and just about every other form of affirmative greeting know. Even saw a few Live Long and Prospers.


      BTW, I tried to get a game of “Where’s Hoodathunk” going, but since no one else knows what you look like, it was seriously going nowhere.

  38. Cats, I understand your sadness. Over the years I’ve had to have two cherished ‘little fellers’ put to sleep; both times I’d have swapped fates with them if only I’d have known who to ‘call.’ And now there’s little Shadow, the stray cat that found us over a year ago. The odds are that she’ll outlive me, I suppose, and that’s not really fair either, I’m thinking. There’s that sharing thing, you know. That mutual promise made at the very beginning. Years of happy happy and then, for one or the other, sadness. Still, remember how much less, for all concerned, each life likely would have been had it not been for that fortuitous union of souls. Cherish the memories; a new reality will likely stop by one day soon, looking for a place to spread that love that blesses all who are able to share it.

    Critters are special.

  39. Glad you were there, Hooda. Looking forward to your first hand perspective.

    Glenn Beck says Wisconsin is the beginning of the North American Caliphate, orchestrated by the merger of the Muslim Brotherhood, the Communists, and the New World Order (or something close to that). I suppose there was a lot of that shit in Madison today, right?

  40. frugal, the police did keep the baggers isolated pretty well but there was an occassional of of camel dung.

    As to numbers, the baggers set up camp on the sidewalk at the SE corner of the Capitol. About half a block long and 30′ wide. Even allowing for multiple personalities, maybe 2,000 of them.

  41. As to the protestors, if you pull up a map of the Capitol Square in Madison you will see it is two blocks to each side with a three lane street around it. It was entirely filled with people marching around. The sidewalks were also fairly well filled on both sides of the street, the three walks up to the building not used by the counter protesters were filled. And the pic Zooey linked to shows what the inside of the building was like. Also, State Street off to the NW was closed to traffic for 4 blocks and was filled as well.

  42. I saw an AP article that said 70k and went on to describe the ‘throngs’ of baggers and the noise from the chanting. It was there alright. The baggers had a speaker with some big amps and speakers and the street marchers drowned her out. Totally sweet.

  43. Even neater is there were almost as many people in Madison today as showed up for the Restoring Honor Tent Revival.

    Also a rumor circulated that $arah was going to show up which led to a number of “Oh plz Palin, come teach Scoty how to quit!”

  44. Cats, so sorry to hear of your loss. My first cat ever was very special like that. Very smart, very sassy and when I’d vacuum she’d go in my kitchen cabinets and knock glasses out to get me to stop. At the time I believed all cats were smart and funny like she was and that the other sweet dumb cat I had at the time was unusual. They are all special in their own ways but some are more special like Ollie. Of course I didn’t think it was possible to find a dog as special as my German shorthaired pointer that died 14 years ago. But now I am totally smitten with that golden retriever. Fortunately that Jack Russell has kept me from pining away all those years. I hope you have somebody there to give you comfort.

  45. signs. Plz forgive typos and missing words. I’m beat and the pain killers are beginning to kick for my back. But, damn, it was worth it. I wish you all could have been there. A major shot of we aren’t done yet.

  46. It was great meeting PamperoFirpo. I expect he will be joining us here in the near future. The guy has the fire and energy of a ferret on speed and the heart of a lion.

  47. The best part of it was the overwhelming feeling of community. I have a bit of a crowd phobia but it was minimal today. No one was going to stampede that bunch and even if something happened, they would have stood together. Several times I saw where a bagger tried to angrily engage one of the marchers. Before the incident had a chance to escalate, other marchers would gather round and convince the marcher who got suckered in that it just wasn’t worth it and off the march went leaving a frustrated bagger.

    Also, there was an incredible number of signs, posted and carried that said “This is a peaceful protest! Do all you can to keep it so.”

    It was like a profootball game without seats and everyone rooting for the same team. Only way more personal. No sitting in seats, everyone walking and talking, sharing signs, well wishes and lots of smiles.

    • That’s the thing that infuriates the Lumpy Fux crowd, Hooda.

      They are not rioting, they are being polite, they are a community working together. What’s to criticize about that? They must be destroyed!!!

  48. It was kinda funny when the local Faux station tried to do a Live at Five type thing. The crowd had been in a bit of a lull as the first shift headed home for dinner. (The CNN dork took advantage of that for a live report and got away with it just about 20 minutes before). They had a sort of news desk set up at the end of East Wash but by the time they got the camera set to go, the thing had been surrounded by several hundred protesters. Lots of ‘Fox Lies’ chants as well as many others. It was hilarious to watch.

  49. I’ve known creationists– they won’t dispute the adaptation described in the post, and they will dismiss it as “micro-evolution”.

    But then, they wouldn’t be satisfied even if they got to observe a coelacanth turning into a salamander.

  50. Zooey, I LOVE that story about the tattoo! Again, I must ask, WTF is wrong with these people? Why do they feel they can use only selected parts of the Bible to justify their hatred? And it IS hatred. One would have to conclude that they don’t take the Bible as seriously as they claim when they do that.

    I wish there was an easily-locatable YouTube clip of the scene from The West Wing when Bartlett rips into a conservative female hate-spewing radio jock. (A bunch of popular radio personalities had been invited to the WH from both sides of the political spectrum.) She first caught his eye when he noticed she was the only one not standing when he entered the room. Earlier, Bartlett had been telling Toby that he was curious about a school board race in New Hampshire. It was the guy he beat for his House seat. The guy was a total right-wing Christian who constantly quoted the Bible, especially Leviticus, for his views. Toby asked how he beat him and Bartlett said he couldn’t remember.

    So, seeing the woman remaining defiantly seated, Bartlett stopped himself and asked her if she was who he thought she was (a Dr Laura Schlesinger-type who also liked to quote Leviticus). She said yes so he started going through the whole spiel we’ve seen done on TP. Something like, “My wife likes to wear clothing made from two different cloths. Do I have have to have her stoned to death? My brother plants two different crops side by side on his farm. How should I have him killed? My Chief of Staff likes to work weekends. Should I kill him myself or should I have the Capitol Police do it?” Along with a bunch of others. Then he reminded her that “In this building, when the President enters the room, everybody stands,” and he glared at her until she got the hint and stood up. Then he turned to Toby and said, “That’s how I beat him.” It has always been one of my favorite scenes.

    So, whenever anyone tries to tell me that homosexuality is wrong based solely on what the Bible says, I know I don’t have to take another thing they say seriously. Especially if it’s a woman wearing clothing from two different crops. And even more especially if they’re wearing a lobster bib at the time. πŸ™‚

    [That reminds me. If the Puritans left Europe because it wasn’t religious enough (not, as we were taught as youngsters, “to escape religious persecution”) and settled in the Boston area, how did seafood become such an important industry in that area?]

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