The Watering Hole, 4-16-14: Utopia

Utopia, that perfect world.

But defining that world means different things to different people.

Every religion,
Every political system,
Every economic system,
All are centered on some idea of Utopia.


The list is endless.

What is your idea of Utopia?

We are, at this moment, living in a compromise, a Utopia made up of competing visions of how the world should be.

True power lies not in the wanting, but in the not wanting.

Open Thread.


39 thoughts on “The Watering Hole, 4-16-14: Utopia

  1. Utopia: A car manufactured in North Korea by Dearleaderbadhair. It’s made of cardboard and pulled by political dissidents .
    It makes the Trabant look like a Bentley.

  2. I was going to mention that you forgot “Teabaggerism”, but then on second glance I see it’s number one on the list, just spelled differently. ๐Ÿ˜†

  3. A โ€˜utopiaโ€™ of any flavor is an ideological fantasy. Regardless of the kind, they all require that every person has an absolute belief in and absolute adherence to the rules/laws/mores/etc. of that utopian dream.

    A utopia is not dependent on the actual ideology it claims (or I should say, any ideology could have its utopia — if only everyone would go along), and is completely dependent on the willingness of the people living there to relinquish any thoughts or actions that run contrary to the utopia’s selected ideology (because one dissatisfied member of a utopia makes it, by definition, no longer a utopia).

    To have a fascist utopia, you cannot have a single socialist (or any other opposing ideology). And just the same, you cannot have a socialist utopia if there is just one fascist among you.

    Ultimately, is not every idea of utopia the exact opposite of free will, because all MUST abide by the utopian setting?

    (Sorry about my limited posting โ€“ my home computer is an XP and is currently off-line. Working on a replacementโ€ฆ)

      • Yeah, I can see that. But I’m not all that upset — I figure that they supported it for 12 years, and that is more than I’d have expected in this day and age.

    • I don’t know, in my idea of utopia everyone wants to share everything freely because they have lost the idea of self and see others and their well being as no longer being separate from themselves. I think this might also be my idea of heaven.

      • I agree with that…but that also speaks to my argument: a ‘utopia’ has everything to do with people and basically everyone being ‘on the same page’.

        Ultimately, everyone in a society could lose their sense of self in ideologies that we disagree with (say, fascism) and still acheive their version of utopia: what is essential is everyone following the same set of rules and standards becasue they beleive in that. Obviously you don’t find utopia if some are being forced or coerced into being a part. I would imagine it is not much of a utopia if it includes physiacally excluding those not of the ideology.

        Basically, given human nature, I do not believe that such a thing is ever acheivable, and different groups seeking their version of it is the root of many atrocities throughout history.

    • Hi Butterfly, what’s the neighborhood like on G St near the swim center? As I journey toward that last roundup i was pondering a place with a nice waterhole where I could wind down with a nice relaxing swim for a year or two or ten! ๐Ÿ˜€

      • No idea, Pachy, but the neighborhood on 6th street across from the funeral home is great. ๐Ÿ™‚

        You keep saying you’re coming to Oregon, but I’ll believe it when I see you standing on my doorstep!

  4. In 8th grade we had a class where we had to come up with a way to manage a city. It was a social studies class.

    I came up with a system called Equalism. I wrote up a short “bill of rights” style list of things that were important. But the basic premise was everyone was equal, without any exceptions for any reason. I also instituted a minimum wage as well as a maximum wage. I came up with some factor around 14x could be between the two wages. Basic food and housing would be provided for everyone, and taxes would be collected to pay for this. I don’t recall if I mentioned health care in the proposal. Everyone would be expected to work, even to some degree for the betterment of the whole city. It would be a mix of a Representative-style democracy (to elect a small council to manage things on a more day-to-day basis) with many decisions open to a direct vote of the people.

    So it was my 8th-grade interpretation of Socialism, with a few other isms thrown in.


    The Titanic Sunk 102 Years Ago Tonight

    In other CNN “breaking news”: Amelia Earhart is still lost.

  6. I kinda wonder if maybe permanent residence in a cemetery might not be a Utopia of sorts. I mean, no matter how many people reside there, no matter their race, religion, national origin, criminality or innocence, their age — all’s peaceful there. No loudmouthed assholes, no bullying, no political speeches, no gunfire, no worries about global warming, no Fox News — Utopia!

    Hmmm. Lessee: let me edit that just a tiny bit:

    I kinda wonder if maybe permanent residence in a cemetery might not be a Utopia of sorts. I mean, no matter how many people reside there, no matter their race, religion, national origin, criminality or innocence, their age — all’s peaceful there. No loudmouthed assholes, no bullying, no political speeches, no gunfire, no worries about global warming, NO FOX NEWS!! — Utopia!

    That could work.

    • I wish Republicans would pay attention to Fox’s reports of the lying Obama administration and the distortions inherent in the liberal media and work to enact laws making lies put forth by government, news agencies and advertising illegal!

    • Just what every home with a one, two and four year old needs, a gun within their reach…

  7. It’s reading as if ZooTopia may be forming in the Pacific Northwest: Cats & Nonewhere are settled; Zooey has alighted, pachy is thinking about a west coast visit/living situation…

  8. Heh! I saw a great name for the range war yahoos in Nevada. Y’all Qaeda. Although; I think it would better describe their hate for all things foreign if it was spelled “Y’all Kayduh”.

      • I think I saw it on MMfA first and nearly wet myself. I hope it continues to spread so we can see people like Bill0 and inSeannity whine about mean ol’ “libruls” calling them names!

    • This could be a major step toward finding cures, or at least slowing down rapid growth of some cancers!
      (still need to have a peer review/paper on this possibility. May the research go forward at a swift pace)

  9. Made it Washington. It’s so green here already! Tomorrow we will go see what’s left of the Cherry Bloom. Then wander around, maybe go to the Air and Space Museum. Then going to the Philharmonic tomorrow night. Long day to get here though so it’s off to get some rest.

    • May the weather be favorable for all your adventures in Washington DC!
      Please take us along w/pics and descriptions!

  10. Holy Bible Could Become Louisiana’s Official Book

    … A mix of Republicans and Democrats moved the measure forward, which would designate the oldest edition of the Holy Bible in the Louisiana State Museum system as the official book.

    Initially, lawmakers had proposed the King James version of the Bible as the official book, but that met with objections from some in the Legislature who thought it might alienate Catholics, among others, who do not use the King James text.

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